[00:00] pr2012: tjholowaychuk- a issue with express-contrib 0.3.3, Cannot call method 'concat' of undefined
[00:00] pr2012:     at Object.<anonymous> (/usr/local/lib/node/.npm/express-contrib/0.3.3/package/lib/express-contrib/namespace.js:48:24)
[00:00] pr2012: looks like versioning from what I read in a forum
[00:01] tjholowaychuk: what version of express are you using?
[00:01] tjholowaychuk: it relies on a newer connect
[00:02] tjholowaychuk: well that one specific module does
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[00:06] Ikaros: Hey - is there a way to get sub-millisecond timing in node? I'm trying to optimise something but console.time just reports 0ms
[00:07] mscdex: that's some optimization
[00:07] softdrink: can you do the operation many more times and average it?
[00:07] Ikaros: Well its in a loop and I need it to run as many times as possible
[00:07] Ikaros: That might work
[00:08] Evet_ has joined the channel
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[00:09] Ikaros: But the short answer is node doesn't support sub-millisecond timing?
[00:09] pr2012: tjholowaychuk im using 1.0.3
[00:09] tjholowaychuk: pr2012: try updating connect
[00:09] softdrink: not that i'm aware of
[00:10] bingomanatee: Hey - who took all the node.js jobs? Nothing on craig's list at all!
[00:10] softdrink: bingomanatee:  it was TJ
[00:10] Ikaros: @softdrink kk, that's what I needed to know - thanks
[00:10] tjholowaychuk: haha
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[00:10] gkatsev: he's working 20 jobs?
[00:10] softdrink: *and* cranking out libs.
[00:10] softdrink: dude's insane.
[00:10] gkatsev: impressive
[00:10] softdrink: ¬¬
[00:11] gkatsev: maybe he is a being of a higher dimension and thus he has much more time than we do.
[00:12] softdrink: i desperately need more time to work on my projects
[00:12] tjholowaychuk: ditto
[00:12] tjholowaychuk: tons more in mind
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[00:12] softdrink: same here
[00:12] softdrink: too many ideas, far too little time
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[00:13] tjholowaychuk: oh well, not a bad way to be :)
[00:13] tjholowaychuk: when you run out of ideas
[00:13] tjholowaychuk: then you're fucked
[00:13] softdrink: good point
[00:13] softdrink: my kids eat up all of my time outside of work
[00:13] softdrink: good thing they're cute
[00:13] softdrink: jerks.
[00:13] softdrink: ¬¬
[00:14] gkatsev: softdrink: teach them how to program. Free labor.
[00:14] tjholowaychuk: hahaha
[00:14] softdrink: they're all on the autism spectrum, so they may actually turn out to be good little engineers in the long run :)
[00:15] softdrink: wow that statement could totally be taken the wrong way.
[00:15] gkatsev: haha
[00:15] gkatsev: 
ACTION calls the police

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[00:16] softdrink: high functioning autism tends to be a benefit to detail-oriented creative problem solving professions
[00:16] softdrink: </blanket statement>
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[00:17] torvalamo: are you trying to sell your kids?
[00:17] softdrink: lol nooooo
[00:17] torvalamo: i'll give you $100 for one
[00:18] softdrink: heh… they'll cost you a hell of a lot more than that post-purchase :P
[00:18] torvalamo: i could use someone to proof read for me
[00:18] softdrink: hehe
[00:18] gkatsev: 
ACTION heads home

[00:19] softdrink: i have a 3 year old boy and twin 2 year old girls… none of which talk… but damn you should see one of them play angry birds.
[00:20] tmzt: they read?
[00:20] softdrink: tmzt:  not that i'm aware of
[00:20] softdrink: doubt it though
[00:21] softdrink: they all really really love to flip through books that have animals in them though
[00:21] tmzt: so, I'm looking for an infrastructure that makes building a new site as easy as possible
[00:21] fairwinds: mscdex: found that I can use api. An going to do a lookup of countries using http://api.geonames.org/countryInfoJSON?username=demo. An use geonameId for country selected to provide list of subdivisions using query like http://api.geonames.org/childrenJSON?formatted=true&geonameId=6251999&username=demo
[00:21] tmzt: but is clean and fun to work with once it's built the scaffold
[00:21] tmzt: using node.js
[00:21] mscdex: fairwinds: cool
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[00:21] softdrink: tmzt:  site or app?
[00:21] torvalamo: sammy.js client side
[00:22] tmzt: app which is also a site
[00:22] tmzt: I'm using sammy but parts of it don't work very well so I'm back to serving static pages
[00:22] torvalamo: hm i wonder if angular.js has come along
[00:22] tmzt: now I'm looking at backend which seems to have a nice way of handling collections
[00:22] softdrink: i've been hacking out a 100% client-side app for usability testing, built with ActiveJS and MooTools
[00:23] tmzt: but I want to use something like jeditable for editing but with grid support without limited the flexibility of the html (so not dojo)
[00:23] softdrink: I've been using ActiveRoutes and ActiveRecord from ActiveJS… pretty easy to use
[00:24] softdrink: i'm not 100% sold on either one though, but they're handy
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[00:24] softdrink: i'll likely roll my own at somepoint… it's The Engineering Way™
[00:24] fairwinds: mscdex: yeah, just had to sign up for a free account and activate api in my account
[00:24] tmzt: this is the story though, not that node should ever be rails but that there should be a good starting point for building apps
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[00:26] softdrink: there's also node-boilerplate
[00:26] softdrink: it's quite handy
[00:26] softdrink: https://github.com/robrighter/node-boilerplate
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[00:28] mscdex: someone ought to come up with a name generator for node projects
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[00:29] softdrink: just take a random line from /usr/share/dict/words  and throw "node-" in front of it
[00:29] softdrink: BAM
[00:29] mscdex: i could do that myself, but i was looking for something more creative
[00:29] softdrink: time to go home
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[00:47] desaiu: http://dpaste.com/353799/ this is the error i get when i try to run the app.js file located with nodepad: https://github.com/alexyoung/nodepad.git
[00:48] desaiu: i've never seen anything like it
[00:48] desaiu: I suppose this is the better link: https://github.com/alexyoung/nodepad
[00:49] tjholowaychuk: desaiu: session({ secret: 'foo' })
[00:49] tjholowaychuk: stack traces are your friend
[00:50] tjholowaychuk: if you looked at the first filename you would see it :p
[00:50] k04n: hey - anyone here know of any sample node.js code that is similar to etherpad?
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[00:51] k04n: looking for something uber-minimal...just the basic core
[00:51] desaiu: tjholowaychuk: where are you seeing this?
[00:51] tjholowaychuk: desaiu: in your stack trace lol
[00:52] tjholowaychuk:  /home/desai/local/lib/node/.npm/connect/0.5.5/package/lib/connect/middleware/session.js:45:13
[00:52] tjholowaychuk: gotta actually look at these things :p
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[00:55] jesusabdullah: What is etherpad?
[00:55] jesusabdullah: hmm
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[00:55] jesusabdullah: k04n: Not off-hand
[00:55] k04n: jesusabdullah: ok, thank you...
[00:56] phed__: hi
[00:56] jesusabdullah: k04n: You can probably find the pieces in different areas, though. For instance, there's a few chat room examples you could probably glean some useful information from
[00:56] phed__: is there any problems with using "ajax" against any other port than the source html?
[00:56] jesusabdullah: You may also find socket.io and dnode useful for communication between things
[00:57] desaiu: what is this session({ secret: 'foo' }) and where does it go?
[00:57] desaiu: 
ACTION is sleepy

[00:57] jesusabdullah: What do you mean?
[00:57] k04n: basically im looking for something where multiple clients are connected..and can both edit the same <textarea>
[00:57] phed__: jesusabdullah: me?
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[00:58] phed__: eg if i run a http server at port 80, and have another server at port 8080 - the webpage is hosted at 80 and tries to access a service at 8080
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[00:59] jesusabdullah: phed__: Yeah, I think so? I just got confuzzled by your question. Tbh, I probably don't know the answer, though.
[00:59] jesusabdullah: Oddly enough, I usually don't do web programming with node!
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[01:00] phed__: jesusabdullah: well, i have had issues when deploying such things earlier
[01:00] phed__: but that was, ehm, ages ago
[01:00] phed__: before node.js; using twisted
[01:00] bingomanatee: okay - I'm having problems getting the noogle to keep running after I close my terminal window. 
[01:01] bingomanatee: I type node index.js & 
[01:01] phed__: now i want to go node.js + twisted; but still want the app to talk to the twisted install on another port
[01:01] bingomanatee: but when I close the terminal it goes down. 
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[01:01] jesusabdullah: The only thing I know about ajax is that you can't do ye standard ajax with a server other than the one that the page came from. Idk about ports, though.
[01:01] phed__: jesusabdullah: ok, that's the big question i guess
[01:02] phed__: jesusabdullah: ports, i mean
[01:02] tim_smart: ryah: https://gist.github.com/405862927250d966b31a
[01:02] tim_smart: This is after a `make distclean && ./configure && make && sudo make install`
[01:02] phed__: jesusabdullah: it might be that in the deployment sitaution where ports _seemed_ to make a difference it was a complex frontend apache install
[01:02] tim_smart: Latest master using GCC
[01:03] phed__: jesusabdullah: but i'd love a definite answer - any idea where i can ask?
[01:03] phed__: jesusabdullah: i read through tons of spec without a definitive answer :\
[01:04] jesusabdullah: phed__: #node.js is actually a pretty good place to ask, usually; Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like the smart people are here. ;) Like I said, I'm not much of a web guy.
[01:04] jesusabdullah: phed__: Maybe try asking again in a few hours?
[01:04] phed__: ok
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[01:05] jesusabdullah: Oh
[01:05] rjrodger: phed: ports have to match too
[01:05] jesusabdullah: phed__: #javascript would know too----oh nvm
[01:05] phed__: errrr that's sorta too funny
[01:06] phed__: i guess that makes me ask
[01:06] phed__: does node.js do _proper_ proxy? ;)
[01:06] CIA-99: node: 03Ryan Dahl 07master * r72bef51 10/ wscript : 
[01:06] CIA-99: node: Revert "Preprocess out assert()"
[01:06] CIA-99: node: This reverts commit 8bd7e4fad81bb62cb463831800ddde5059969f6b. - http://bit.ly/hsEQ6E
[01:06] phed__: (for the sake of question, when i tried to ask apache to do it, it failed miserably)
[01:06] jesusabdullah: What do you mean by _proper_?
[01:07] jesusabdullah: You can proxy with node
[01:07] jesusabdullah: A lot of people use nginx for proxying, though
[01:07] jesusabdullah: they throw nginx on the front and proxy requests to multiple node instances
[01:07] jesusabdullah: At least, that's one way to do it
[01:07] phed__: basically, what apache did was to wait for the webpage to end its feed (in case of, eh, not-done-yet-feeds), before it proxied it forward
[01:07] phed__: making it useless for longrunning connections
[01:08] jesusabdullah: It's also possible with apache. There was an article in either /r/node or /r/javascript about it, should still be in the first few pages
[01:08] phed__: yeah, i guess the term is streaming proxy
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[01:08] phed__: ok, cool
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[01:09] phed__: point is that the endless amount of proxyconfigs i tried would block in the most unixy way possible
[01:09] phed__: but cool, then i can at least try some different configs - but it will add some overhead :\
[01:10] phed__: I guess I could somehow config a twisted-web to handle out stuff to node.js in a transparent manner
[01:13] phed__: OR if I deem the twisted server to require low-latency to communicate with the node.js through UNIX-ports (if that's possible) or any other RPC mechanism 
[01:15] phed__: jesusabdullah: does nginx really handle streaming sockets?
[01:15] phed__: ie websockets
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[01:15] jesusabdullah: phed__: I can't tell you from experience, unfortunately, but given its popularity I would imagine so
[01:16] phed__: jesusabdullah: well, you're probably right. but let me point out that popularity is a terrible metric :P
[01:17] sh1mmer has joined the channel
[01:17] jesusabdullah: popularity *within the node.js community*
[01:17] jesusabdullah: I should say
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[01:17] jesusabdullah: but you're right.
[01:17] phed__: jesusabdullah: the deeper you get into some expert domain the brighter you'll see that the majority does something wrong (with majority increasing with expertise ;) )
[01:17] phed__: ok, makes sense hehe :)
[01:18] jesusabdullah: My expertise is in snow and ice, truth be told
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[01:21] phed__: :)
[01:21] CIA-99: node: 03Ali Farhadi 07master * r910a859 10/ test/simple/test-http-many-keep-alive-connections.js : Adding test for many keep-alive connections - http://bit.ly/fytSwz
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[01:24] phed__: jesusabdullah: i guess my next forte is to find good material on how to code "node.js"-friendly clientside
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[01:24] phed__: I've found that most of my stuff won't per se require a node.js install, but that it will be used as a failover for the app for non-long-running-stuff
[01:25] tmzt: phed__: what's the twisted for?
[01:25] phed__: video
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[01:25] tmzt: bingomanatee: you need nohub, screen, spark(2), forever, etc.
[01:25] phed__: and i don't want web to clutter the process
[01:26] phed__: i mean, i've done a similar install that ran nice for 6 years without restart 
[01:26] phed__: err sorry, 4 years 
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[01:27] phed__: but twisted-web is not that easy to make garbage-free
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[01:28] Matt__: Hey all, I was wondering.... is anyone using express and backbone.js together? 
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[01:28] tmzt: Matt__: looking into that
[01:28] hvgotcodes: how do i tell which version of node i have?
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[01:29] hvgotcodes: i am using nvm 0.1.91
[01:29] guybrush: nvm list
[01:29] hvgotcodes: guybrush: sorry just saw that
[01:29] hvgotcodes: is 0.1.91 the latest node version?
[01:29] lazukars: How do you avoid restarting the server every time you made a change to a file and want to see the results locally?
[01:30] guybrush: `v git node
[01:30] v8bot: guybrush: ry/node - GitHub - https://github.com/ry/node
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[01:31] phed__: jesusabdullah: on the port thing above - sad to know that i had to ask IRC to get the definite. I think it's possible to do something else with flash policy servers etc, but that's just bad :)
[01:33] Matt__: tmzt: I feel like they step on each other's toes a little bit, but combined, they could be really powerful.
[01:33] hvgotcodes: sorry to ask a really simple question, but i put the hello world example in a .js file ran it, and get ReferenceError: console is not defined
[01:34] bingomanatee: tmzt - where would I find forever?
[01:35] Matt__: bingomanatee: are you looking for https://github.com/indexzero/forever ?
[01:35] CIA-99: node: 03Ryan Dahl 07master * r129217a 10/ test/simple/test-repl.js : 
[01:35] CIA-99: node: Increase timeout on test-repl to 5 seconds
[01:35] CIA-99: node: Hopefully wont get failures on buildbot slaves. - http://bit.ly/eNyr1Z
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[01:44] bingomanatee: nohup seems to be working. If noogle crashes its tmzt's fault now
[01:45] ChrisPartridge: v8: console.log("<%(tag)>%(inner)</%(tag)>");
[01:45] v8bot: ChrisPartridge: CONSOLE: ["<%(tag)>%(inner)</%(tag)>"], OUTPUT: undefined
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[01:53] ChrisPartridge: v8: var test = "<%(tag)>%(inner)</%(tag)>";
[01:53] v8bot: ChrisPartridge: undefined
[01:55] cloudhead: is there a built-in way to get the hostname?
[01:55] ChrisPartridge: cloudhead: http://nodejs.org/docs/v0.3.6/api/os.html
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[01:57] cloudhead: ChrisPartridge: awesome, thanks
[01:58] ChrisPartridge: yw
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[01:59] bronson: Is there an autoreload for node?  I'm playing w Express right now and tiring of stomping on reload. 
[02:00] bronson: middleware like Ruby's Shotgun would be sweet but can't find anything like it...?
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[02:04] ChrisPartridge: bronson: I'm pretty sure there is something around
[02:04] bronson: ChrisPartridge, just found something
[02:04] bronson: http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs/browse_thread/thread/c9b82171d3c7aac2
[02:05] bronson: sounds like restarting the app works well but node isn't ready to reload packages.
[02:06] bronson: dang, that thread is 2 years old.  thought it was 1 year.
[02:06] ChrisPartridge: hah
[02:07] ChrisPartridge: check github for felixge
[02:09] bronson: ChrisPartridge, this looks most promising: https://github.com/isaacs/node-supervisor
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[02:10] ChrisPartridge: bronson: Looks good, isaacs too so it has too be good :-)
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[02:14] tmzt: supervisor doesn't have spark support though
[02:15] ChrisPartridge: tmzt: spark?
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[02:16] bronson: https://github.com/senchalabs/spark I guess
[02:16] tmzt: yeah, so that I can have a app.js instead of server.js, which exports the server as the module.export
[02:17] tmzt: it makes it easier to run on a different port, or eventually, to use a unix socket
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[02:18] bronson: sort of an inetd approach to node apps?
[02:18] tmzt: sort of
[02:18] tmzt:  I guess with node startup changing to js this might be easier in the future
[02:20] bronson: Having a hard time figuring out what version of node to start writing my app with.
[02:20] tmzt: ryah is talking about releasing 0.4 early next month, as a stable version
[02:20] bronson: All the tutorials seem to break on 0.3.x but I'm worried about porting from 0.2.x
[02:21] bronson: tmzt, that's good new.
[02:21] bronson: news.
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[02:28] ChrisPartridge: tmzt: does the ssl feature of spark work?
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[02:32] JimBastard: anyone wanna tag team with me on a blog post? i've got a shit ton of data on github organizations now, their projects, watchers / forks, and language
[02:32] JimBastard: all in JSON
[02:32] JimBastard: i wanna do like math stuff to it and feed it to something like R
[02:32] tmzt: ChrisPartridge: haven't tried it
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[02:34] ChrisPartridge: JimBastard: perhaps some graphing?
[02:34] ChrisPartridge: JimBastard: what is R?
[02:34] JimBastard: ChrisPartridge: thats the idea yeah
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[02:35] ryah: don't worry about porting to v0.3
[02:35] JimBastard: ChrisPartridge: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R_(programming_language)
[02:35] ryah: you should do it
[02:35] ryah: code that isn't ported in the next few weeks is going to get left behind
[02:35] tmzt: ryah: is node.js compiled?
[02:36] tim_smart: ryah: Did you get my message above?
[02:36] ryah: tmzt: ?
[02:36] ryah: tim_smart: fixed it already
[02:36] tim_smart: ryah: <3
[02:36] tmzt: ryah: the new node.js in 0.4, is it compiled into the binary?
[02:36] tmzt: https://github.com/ry/node/blob/master/src/node.js
[02:37] ryah: tmzt: everything in node is compiled into the binary
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[02:37] ryah: 
ACTION hates dynamic linking

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[02:38] JimBastard: FATAL ERROR: Allocation failed - process out of memory
[02:38] JimBastard: win
[02:38] tim_smart: JimBastard is too awesome for RAM
[02:38] JimBastard: tim_smart: indeed, i should stream my writes
[02:39] JimBastard: im essentially pulling data from the web and writing a huge json fragment
[02:39] tim_smart: <3 redis message queues
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[02:41] tim_smart: ryah: Does node have the crankshaft improvements from V8 yet?
[02:41] ryah: tim_smart: yes
[02:42] tim_smart: Notice much improvement?
[02:42] ryah: no
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[02:42] tim_smart: Sad face.
[02:42] ryah: it's been suggested that the module system might somehow be shifting us off the optimized path
[02:43] tim_smart: Hm
[02:43] slickplaid: hrm... redis_node or node-redis, which to choose...
[02:43] ryah: the big function that wraps each module is apparently throwing node into the bad case
[02:43] tim_smart: slickplaid: node-redis if you don't need pub sub (I haven't implemented it yet) and want something super fast. Otherwise redis_node.
[02:44] tmzt: yeah, what is that used for? there's no way to create a new context in v8 api?
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[02:44] slickplaid: I went with redis_node last time, so I'll go with node-redis this time... Thanks tim_smart :D
[02:44] tim_smart: tmzt: You just have to pass a flag and it will switch to using contexts.
[02:45] tim_smart: (The module system)
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[02:47] pyrotechnick: what's up with mongoose
[02:47] pyrotechnick: they've changed the repo
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[02:47] tim_smart: Github line numbers make me angry :( http://dl.dropbox.com/u/396394/screenshots/github_line%23.png
[02:47] pyrotechnick: removed npm package.json
[02:47] bingomanatee has joined the channel
[02:47] pyrotechnick: tim_smart: that link 404s
[02:48] pyrotechnick: u cant have # in filenames
[02:48] tim_smart: Dropbox makes me angry.
[02:48] pyrotechnick: yeah that is retarded
[02:48] tim_smart: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/396394/screenshots/github_line_no.png
[02:48] pyrotechnick: theyre trying to be clever
[02:48] pyrotechnick: but really it's just fucking annoying
[02:49] pyrotechnick: whatever happened to KISS
[02:49] ryah: tim_smart, pyrotechnick: yes very stupid
[02:50] ryah: they wont even do really necessary things like damn code review
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[02:50] pyrotechnick: i've considered making a github clone in node much like gitosis
[02:50] ryah: and fancy file browser is broken
[02:51] pyrotechnick: see the beauty would be
[02:51] tim_smart: The line numbers probablyy work in safari on Mac or something.
[02:51] pyrotechnick: what you'd do is write the app so it could be used locally or as a github
[02:51] pyrotechnick: so it's both your git GUI
[02:51] pyrotechnick: as well as your github
[02:51] pyrotechnick: same interface
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[02:51] pyrotechnick: same codebase
[02:51] ryah: i don't get that strange line number thing
[02:52] pyrotechnick: it's them trying to be too clever
[02:52] ryah: it must be a bug
[02:52] pyrotechnick: it's retarded
[02:52] ryah: on chrome10/linux it works
[02:52] tim_smart: ryah: Chromium on Ubuntu here.
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[02:52] tim_smart: I'm using the chromium daily ppa.
[02:53] tim_smart: Buts it like that on the chrome dev channel as well.
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[03:00] JimBastard: tim_smart: i setup a write stream, i think it will not die now
[03:00] JimBastard: 853 and going
[03:01] JimBastard: node is holding around 400mb
[03:03] JimBastard: 600mb, i dont think shes gonna hold
[03:03] JimBastard: i might have to get some sleep and actually write this correctly
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[03:10] ryah: is test/simple/test-http-many-keep-alive-connections.js failing for anyone?
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[03:21] lukegalea: Hey. Is there any *easy* way to vendor my npm modules? And update them as required? 
[03:21] lukegalea: npm install doesn't accept a dir... otherwise we could do the npm equivelent of "gem install -i gems/  blah"
[03:22] lukegalea: any ideas?
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[03:31] keks: hi, is there a way open a unix pipe and make it accessible for a child process? couldn't realli find anything in the docs and only weird stuff in the tests
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[04:12] bingomanatee: You guys are really really awesome. 
[04:12] bingomanatee: I just did a noogle search for "Awesome" and the results were pretty damn....
[04:13] chapel: link?
[04:13] JimBastard: { '/cloudant':     { totalWatchers: 274,      totalProjects: 10,      watchersPerLanguage: { Erlang: 18, Python: 240, Java: 12, Ruby: 4 } } }
[04:13] JimBastard: that seems almost right
[04:13] JimBastard: hey chapel 
[04:14] bingomanatee: http://www.narrative.io:3000
[04:14] chapel: hey JimBastard
[04:14] JimBastard: massive updates coming 
[04:14] JimBastard: :-D
[04:14] chapel: nice bingomanatee
[04:14] JimBastard: finally getting a proper update button lol
[04:14] chapel: what kind of updates?
[04:14] JimBastard: and even api documentation
[04:14] chapel: yay
[04:14] JimBastard: api updates all around
[04:14] bingomanatee: 
ACTION is building the ultimate antisocial network

[04:14] SubStack: want!
[04:14] JimBastard: finally got resoucer validation working with json-schema
[04:15] lukegalea has joined the channel
[04:15] JimBastard: so thats been a help
[04:15] SubStack: bingomanatee: call it bookface
[04:15] bingomanatee: I own mylinkedface
[04:15] JimBastard: i want to make the anti-social bookmarking site
[04:15] bingomanatee: If anyone wants to point it at something intersting let me know. 
[04:15] keks: mylinkedfacepora
[04:16] SubStack: myface
[04:17] SubStack: wow that exists
[04:17] bingomanatee: funny thing - when I index the data on my linode it spikes so high that linode shuts it down so I have to index locally on my laptop. 
[04:17] chapel: index the irc?
[04:17] chapel: logs that is
[04:18] bingomanatee: myface - its like facebook, except that its like myspace. 
[04:18] chapel: oh
[04:18] bingomanatee: and youtube!
[04:18] asimismo has joined the channel
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[04:18] bingomanatee: And its a first person shooter, and a webcam service. 
[04:18] SubStack: myfaceyoubook
[04:19] bingomanatee: Its a black hole that sucks up every internet cliche, from which not even light can emerge.
[04:19] SubStack: write it in node, it'll scale
[04:19] slickplaid: I've got a question about express (and ejs rendering)... I'm trying to add additional locals: {} in the res.render('index.ejs' { locals: { var: value } }); function... why whenever I attempt to use the variables in the index.ejs it throws a 500 error, but using them in the layout.ejs, they work fine?
[04:19] AAA_awright_ has joined the channel
[04:19] chapel: SubStack
[04:19] SubStack: maybe that is how you beat facebook at its own game
[04:19] SubStack: through parody
[04:19] chapel: you should make dnode work over udp
[04:19] bingomanatee: slickplaid - can you gist your code? that sounds odd.
[04:19] SubStack: and then nobody realizes that it's a joke
[04:20] jimt_ has joined the channel
[04:20] bingomanatee: fishbook.net is another domain I haven't moved on. 
[04:20] SubStack: chapel: dnode needs reliable messages I think
[04:20] bingomanatee: Its going to be a social network for fish. 
[04:20] chapel: well couldn't you write some ecc?
[04:20] chapel: :P
[04:20] bingomanatee: I'm self-studying ruby - maybe I can RoR Fishbook.net
[04:20] SubStack: chapel: you can pass your own stream to dnode
[04:21] chapel: yeah I know
[04:21] SubStack: it can be udp or whatever
[04:21] keks: bingomanatee: or, like, snailbook
[04:21] bingomanatee: "Fishbook.net: over 1,200,000,000 users, most of them plankton.
[04:21] bingomanatee: "
[04:21] SubStack: fido or zoa?
[04:22] bingomanatee: That would be kind of fun. I can make fake social networks of barnacles and plankton. 
[04:23] slickplaid: i just pulled a brand new https://github.com/robrighter/node-boilerplate and i'm trying to add a new locals: variable to the only .get route (non-error) on it, let me show you on the source real quick
[04:23] bingomanatee: "Seahorse131 just had 800 babies. Would you like to see their pictues?"
[04:24] slickplaid: bingomanatee: https://github.com/robrighter/node-boilerplate/blob/master/server.js after line 71, add another variable && on https://github.com/robrighter/node-boilerplate/blob/master/views/index.ejs try to use that new variable... any idea why it won't work?
[04:24] chapel: SubStack: I was thinking, how you have /dnode.js for the browser, how hard would it be to use a similar technique to send ajax view code to the browser that mirrors your servers views like in express/connect?
[04:25] warz has joined the channel
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[04:26] bingomanatee: salickplaid: I am recreating this on my local stack - any other file dependencies I should be aware of?
[04:27] bingomanatee: I'm grabbing your github stuff. 
[04:27] slickplaid: nope, i just cloned it, built it and tried to edit it to use that new variable
[04:27] slickplaid: let me make a quick gist so you can see what I mean
[04:28] yozgrahame has joined the channel
[04:29] JimBastard: okay, who is nice with graphing software
[04:29] JimBastard: i got the tallys ready
[04:29] slickplaid: https://gist.github.com/91ad50a745d4bb4d90d8
[04:29] slickplaid: that's the only edit i have made and it throws an error :)
[04:29] SubStack: chapel: I have no idea, but that sounds difficult
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[04:31] chapel: well my initial thought would be just to use dnode and something like sammy.js or backbone.js and just override their view logic so that it does an ajax call first and is returned the data to render
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[04:34] pyrotechnick: how is sammy compared to backbone?
[04:34] pyrotechnick: we
[04:34] JImBastard_: stupid irc
[04:34] slickplaid: bingomanatee: any ideas?
[04:34] pyrotechnick: have only used backbone
[04:34] pyrotechnick: and loved it
[04:35] JImBastard_: pyrotechnick: whats up with xp? that project could use some love
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[04:35] keks: can anyone recomment a tutorial/introduction for addons? I want to continue working on fuse.
[04:36] bingomanatee: I will get to you slickplaid - give me a few minutes. 
[04:36] slickplaid: bingomanatee: take your time :) no rush
[04:36] SubStack: chapel: depends mostly on how hard it is to hack around the view rendering I suspect
[04:36] chapel: yeah SubStack
[04:37] chapel: pyrotechnick: sammy is fairly simple in comparison to backbone
[04:37] chapel: mvc versus basically just views
[04:37] chapel: just an idea SubStack
[04:38] chapel: I mean, if it were simpler to handle ajax views, and also have standard non-js views supported out of the box
[04:38] chapel: that would be pretty slick
[04:38] chapel: not have to write two sets of code
[04:38] chapel: of course you can simplify the ends depending on how you do things
[04:40] AAA_awright_ has joined the channel
[04:41] bingomanatee: Hey SubStack
[04:43] SubStack: lots of pms all of the sudden!
[04:44] bingomanatee: that time of the month
[04:44] SubStack: hehe
[04:47] pyrotechnick: SubStack: why you hate me
[04:47] SubStack: !
[04:47] tmzt: is creationix still working on wheat? is anyone using it?
[04:49] tmzt: chapel: I would like to see the form handling of sammy split out from the hash support/routing
[04:50] tmzt: or make the latter optional, it doesn't seem to work correctly
[04:50] tmzt: the form stuff is awesome though
[04:50] chapel: hmm, what do you mean?
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[04:52] tmzt: <form action="#route" method="POST" /> app.post(function(data) {});
[04:52] tmzt: that's all you need
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[04:52] tmzt: with sammy.js to handle form posts
[04:52] chapel: yeah
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[04:53] chapel: you mean you just want that from sammy?
[04:53] tmzt: yeah
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[04:53] chapel: ah
[04:53] tmzt: I'm surving full pages from node/express
[04:53] chapel: yeah it is pretty cool
[04:53] tmzt: then I'm going to look at backend for my collections which I'm currently open coding with jquery
[04:54] tmzt: I need a grid but not one that's designed for sorting and all of that, just adding and removing rows, in place editing, and reverting changes
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[05:00] bingomanatee: slickplaid - haven't used socket - is there an NPM  package I need for it
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[05:07] JImBastard_: so i cant figure out which is funnier
[05:07] JImBastard_: the fact that some of my github rankings came out with negative watchers
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[05:07] JImBastard_: or that the numbers are actually correct
[05:07] JImBastard_: https://github.com/guardian
[05:07] JImBastard_: >>><<<
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[05:12] chapel: thats odd JImBastard_
[05:12] JImBastard_: yeah, ive seen that before
[05:12] JImBastard_: it can happen with caching on github or something
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[05:12] chapel: some corrupted data :)
[05:13] creationix: ryah: is the https server in v0.3.6 supposed to be stable now?
[05:13] creationix: I still can't serve files over 1 chunk long
[05:13] creationix: https://creationix:8433/ for example
[05:13] creationix: I may be doing something wrong, but not sure what
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[05:23] Aikar: ryah: another contribution to module loader, https://github.com/ry/node/pull/584
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[05:25] Aikar: diff of changes for _compile is confusing, just look at full source, simply moved the 'require prep' to its own func
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[05:26] JImBastard_: wow learnboost beat twitter
[05:26] JImBastard_:         "id": [             "/LearnBoost"         ],         "totalWatchers": 3231,         "totalProjects": 14,         "watchersPerLanguage": {             "JavaScript": 2261,             "C++": 929         }
[05:26] mscdex: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHtttx6P7kg
[05:27] Aikar: twitter has a github repo?
[05:28] cloudhead: creationix: It's been stable for me
[05:28] shiawuen: g br
[05:28] shiawuen: oops…sorry
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[05:30] creationix: cloudhead: do you use pipe to stream files
[05:31] cloudhead: creationix: I don't
[05:31] cloudhead: creationix: I do it 'manually'
[05:32] cloudhead: createReadStream + write
[05:32] creationix: cloudhead: http://creationix.com/.nvm/v0.3.6/lib/node/.npm/creationix/0.0.7/package/static.js
[05:32] creationix: maybe it pauses the upstream but never calls resume
[05:33] creationix: it really should support pipe or it's a bug
[05:33] cloudhead: yea
[05:33] cloudhead: hmm
[05:33] creationix: works fine for normal http
[05:33] creationix: just freezes up on https after the first few k of data
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[05:35] patricka_: y9441
[05:35] creationix: the only think I do out of the "ordinary" is stream.once('data', ...) and write the headers before the first chunk
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[05:36] creationix: that way if there is an error I haven't already send the 200 header
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[05:39] cloudhead: could also have to do with the content-length
[05:40] cloudhead: maybe it's somehow using the unencrypted length
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[05:40] creationix: that would be a browser bug right?
[05:40] creationix: I mean, content-length is for the unencrypted data
[05:40] creationix: you can't even read the content-length without decrypting the stream
[05:41] cloudhead: that's true
[05:41] creationix: unless node uses your user-specified content length to do something funny
[05:41] cloudhead: and chunked doesnt have a length
[05:41] cloudhead: are you using chunked?
[05:41] creationix: but I'm pretty sure node ignores most the headers
[05:41] creationix: the only way to do chunked is to not set a content-length
[05:41] creationix: I thought so at least
[05:41] cloudhead: yea
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[05:42] cloudhead: are you setting the content-length?
[05:42] creationix: pretty sure I am
[05:42] cloudhead: hmm
[05:42] cloudhead: what if you buffer it, and send it all on end()?
[05:43] creationix: I can try that 
[05:43] cloudhead: I think that's how I do it
[05:43] creationix: use fs.readFIle instead of readStream
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[05:43] creationix: won't work long term though, I stream movies on this server
[05:43] cloudhead: ah :) might give a clue though
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[05:45] creationix: yeah, same result
[05:45] creationix: https://creationix.com:8433/wordle.jpg
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[05:45] creationix: still pauses after about 15% of the image is loaded
[05:46] ChrisPartridge: any errors being fired?
[05:46] creationix: cloudhead: how does is work for you, this doesn't make sense
[05:46] creationix: no, no errors
[05:46] zzak: failed to load resource: wordle.jpg
[05:46] zzak: thats it tho
[05:46] ChrisPartridge: i get about 1/4 of the image
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[05:46] creationix: lol, someone is trying HEAD requests
[05:46] creationix: my server doesn't implement that
[05:47] zzak: chromium resources i think
[05:47] zzak: gets about 48kb in
[05:47] zzak: not sure if signifigant
[05:48] creationix: zzak: the default chunk size in node is about 40k I think
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[05:49] creationix: exact same code, but without https works fine http://creationix.com:8000/wordle.jpg
[05:49] chapel: creationix
[05:49] creationix: http://creationix.com/server.js
[05:49] chapel: https only sends like 60k
[05:50] bingomanatee: creationix: what is the basis of the tag cloud on your domain?
[05:50] chapel: I had an issue with https client
[05:50] zzak: hmm: "resource interpreted as document but transferred with MIME type image/jpeg" : "wordle.jpg:-1"
[05:50] zzak: gzip maybe?
[05:50] creationix: no, no gzipping
[05:51] creationix: bingomanatee: it's my twitter stream from a while back
[05:51] creationix: fed the rss into the wordle generator
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[05:51] zzak: are you using the updated https node?
[05:51] creationix: zzak, yeah, it's node v0.3.6
[05:51] micheil: maybe try at @head
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[05:52] creationix: I was supposedly working somewhere around 0.3.4, so should be plenty new enough
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[05:52] pyrotechnick: what's with the new v8
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[05:53] pyrotechnick: it doesn't like continues and returns in certain structs
[05:53] pyrotechnick: mongoose fails on it because of continues and returns
[05:53] chapel: creationix: I haven't tried it since 0.3.3 but https client wasn't working, would only send 60k of data before just dying
[05:53] creationix: pyrotechnick: see the changelog
[05:53] pyrotechnick: has anyone actually looked at the code for mongoose?
[05:53] pyrotechnick: it's bizaar
[05:53] creationix: they added a check to refuse invalid continues and returns
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[05:54] creationix: yeah, the client was just now finished, but the server should have been working for some time
[05:54] mjr_: Has anybody tested the https server in 0.3 lately?
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[05:54] mjr_: ryah thinks that it works.
[05:54] creationix: mjr_: I'm trying
[05:54] creationix: cloudhead says it works for him
[05:54] mjr_: But I've not heard of anybody doing rigorous testing.
[05:54] mjr_: Cool.
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[05:54] creationix: I can't seem to serve anything over about 40k
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[05:55] zzak: odd
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[05:56] mjr_: creationix: still?
[05:56] creationix: yep, here is my server http://creationix.com/server.js
[05:56] creationix: exact same request handler, works fine for http, gets stuck for https
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[05:57] ryah: creationix: good to know
[05:57] creationix: ok, trying with HEAD now...
[05:57] ryah: hm, i would really like to get a way to repeat that....
[05:58] ryah: shoul di just try serving a big file?
[05:58] micheil: test/pummel
[05:58] creationix: same problem still https://creationix.com:8433/wordle.jpg
[05:58] creationix: it pauses with both fs.readFile buffering all the content and with piping a readStream
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[06:00] zzak: creationix: does it have to be synchronous readFile?
[06:01] creationix: zzak: the sync readfile is just to get my cert
[06:01] creationix: the actual jpg is normal async reading
[06:01] zzak: ahh
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[06:02] zzak: gotcha, see that in simple/test-htps-simple.js too
[06:02] cloudhead: creationix: I tried with pipe, seems to work fine here
[06:02] cloudhead: but my images aren't that big
[06:02] cloudhead: gonna try with something bigger
[06:02] creationix: try with my wordle
[06:02] cloudhead: ok
[06:03] creationix: get it from port 80 or 433, those work fine
[06:03] cloudhead: yar
[06:03] creationix: (433 is behind an stunnel)
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[06:07] zzak: creationix: https://github.com/ry/node/blob/master/lib/fs.js#L92 is this what you mean by chunks?
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[06:07] creationix: zzak: that a chunk, but not the one I'm talking about
[06:08] tmzt: creationix: I can't get wheat to work, it's not responding with anything
[06:08] creationix: https://github.com/ry/node/blob/master/lib/fs.js#L688
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[06:08] zzak: ahh
[06:08] creationix: looks like readStream chunks are 64kb
[06:09] creationix: tmzt: sorry, I don't support wheat much, did you install with npm?
[06:10] tmzt: no, submodule I can install with npm though
[06:10] creationix: also I think it only works with node 0.2.x
[06:10] creationix: it just works for me and I don't mess with it
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[06:11] creationix: ryah, cloudhead: did either of you reproduce my http problem?
[06:11] tmzt: hmm, the how to node checkout worked fine
[06:12] creationix: tmzt: yeah, it has some pretty terrible error handling
[06:12] tmzt: yeah like it does nothing if there's an error
[06:12] creationix: a single typo in a markdown file will cause flat out errors with no message
[06:12] tmzt: I'll look into what it's doing
[06:12] creationix: tmzt: sorry about that
[06:12] tmzt: it's cool, it looks awesome
[06:12] tmzt: most of my site is jade though not haml
[06:12] creationix: I really wish I had time to rewrite wheat
[06:12] creationix: clean up the code, make it a modular framework
[06:13] tmzt: the git-fs stuff is cool, using git directly like that
[06:13] tmzt: sure, I'm might just plug renderers.js into an express routing setup instead
[06:13] creationix: that could be neat
[06:14] creationix: feel free to torture the code, it's meant to be an example, not a framework
[06:14] tmzt: certainly, I just was trying to get the blog. portion of my site up quickly ;)
[06:15] creationix: tmzt: supposedly, the entire wheat module can be used as an express module
[06:15] creationix: I've never tried though
[06:15] cloudhead: creationix: yea
[06:15] cloudhead: creationix: so I think it has to do with pipe
[06:15] zzak: yah eventually ill think of something to do with my no.de haha, already have a blog :/
[06:15] creationix: cloudhead: yay, I'm not going crazy
[06:15] cloudhead: cause I can't get any images to show up when I use pipe
[06:16] creationix: cloudhead: then why did it crap out when I used fs.readFile?
[06:16] creationix: or was my browser caching the bad result? hmm...
[06:16] cloudhead: yea
[06:16] cloudhead: make sure you shift+refresh
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[06:16] creationix: I was using curl too
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[06:16] cloudhead: ah hm
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[06:16] creationix: doubt that caches much
[06:16] cloudhead: yea
[06:16] cloudhead: hmm
[06:17] creationix: interesting, the browser is making range requests for the jpg
[06:18] creationix: I didn't know they could do that
[06:18] creationix: I guess it's trying to resume the download
[06:18] zzak: https://github.com/ry/node/blob/master/test/simple/test-fs-read-stream.js#L89
[06:18] creationix: zzak: nice, 1 byte chunks
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[06:22] creationix: cloudhead: yep, I can confirm that with fs.readFile, I'm calling res.end(data) with 117865 bytes and the curl client is only getting 16384 bytes
[06:22] creationix: and the Content-Length header is correct at 117865
[06:23] creationix: hence the hanging client
[06:23] creationix: I don't think pump is to blame
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[06:26] creationix: interestingly, I get farther when using pipe than readFile
[06:26] creationix: the clients gets to 26627 bytes before pausing
[06:27] creationix: and if I request the file from localhost on my server, it gets all 115k
[06:27] creationix: ryah: ^^^
[06:27] creationix: that's going to make it harder to test
[06:28] creationix: you have to overload the client before it will get confused and stop sending data
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[06:28] zzak: can you just do a regular ssl request?
[06:28] creationix: zzak: telnet over ssl?
[06:28] creationix: and GET HTTP/1.0 /wordle.jpg
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[06:29] zzak: well, you can make ssl requests to localhost but not remotely right?
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[06:30] dekz: anyone know how well the audio tags work with a local file that is still being written to?
[06:30] creationix: zzak: if the https client is the server itself, it works, but not over the internet
[06:30] creationix: my server is in Texas, I'm in California
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[06:31] zzak: even an empty request?
[06:31] creationix: what do you mean empty request?
[06:31] creationix: I'm doing a plain HTTP GET
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[06:31] zzak: sorry, meant response
[06:32] zzak: without the wordle
[06:32] creationix: yeah, that works fine
[06:32] creationix: it only gets stuck on large bodies
[06:32] zzak: just to confirm the ssl is working properly
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[06:32] creationix: ssl doesn't seem to handle back-pressure well
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[06:33] creationix: zzak: the exact same code (even the same instance of the request handler in memory) works fine for http, but not for https
[06:33] creationix: so it's not the server logic
[06:35] zzak: hmm, just for fun im gonna try to run the HEAD tests with a larger buffersize
[06:36] shiawuen: how about response.end with big chunk of text? maybe it's something to do with serving images?
[06:36] creationix: shiawuen: doubt it, it's all just bits at this layer
[06:37] creationix: interesting, if I refresh often, I can see the effect of tcp backoff patterns
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[06:42] zzak: heh, still passed with a humungous buffersize
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[06:46] dekz: anyone know how well the audio tags work with a local file that is still being written to?
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[06:51] creationix: ryah: also If I hit refresh 3 times fast, my server crashes with https://gist.github.com/ac3ed8cebc407cec1dbf
[06:51] cloudhead: creationix: https://github.com/ry/node/blob/master/lib/tls.js#L280
[06:52] cloudhead: does this make sense to you?
[06:52] cloudhead: seems like it's contradicting itself
[06:52] creationix: cloudhead: no, havePending was set before the loop
[06:53] creationix: meaning there was something pending, but now isn't
[06:53] creationix: you only want to emit once
[06:53] creationix: still, I think the problem may be near there
[06:53] creationix: how do I get those debug statements
[06:53] creationix: node_g ?
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[06:54] creationix: yep, sweet debugs
[06:54] cloudhead: creationix: hm yea you're right, condition changed
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[06:55] creationix: https://gist.github.com/cacb082c80ddfad67978
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[06:59] micheil: anyone seen isaacs about today?
[07:00] Fuld_: micheil: It wasn't our turn to watch him sorry :/
[07:00] mjr_: Oh shit, it was my turn.
[07:01] mjr_: Totally forgot.
[07:01] micheil: uhhh, >_>
[07:01] Fuld_: ;p
[07:02] creationix: there is an awful lot of blowing and sucking going on in tls.js
[07:02] zzak: lol
[07:02] zzak: thats what... nvm
[07:03] creationix: cloudhead: hmm, it stops on a different state every time I run it
[07:03] creationix: it's really inconsistent
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[07:05] bnitica: hi all
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[07:07] bnitica: I have a problem trying to build the node
[07:08] bnitica: rebaseall seems that doesn't help me to go over the "Unable to Remap to Same Address as Parent" issue
[07:08] bnitica: can anybody help me please?
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[07:16] bnitica: anybody?
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[07:16] Guest31915: bnitica puh, i ran into that problem, but i dont remember who i solved it :/ maybe the comment at http://howtonode.org/how-to-install-nodejs can help u?
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[07:17] LouiseCiccone: yo
[07:18] bnitica: thanks, I'll take a look, I am using these onstructions: https://github.com/ry/node/wiki/Building-node.js-on-Cygwin-%28Windows%29
[07:18] LouiseCiccone: <-- a famous node.js developer
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[07:18] Kingdutch: Good for you LouiseCiccone, haven't heared of you
[07:19] LouiseCiccone: :)
[07:19] Kingdutch: bnitica: What's the problem? 
[07:19] bnitica: rebaseall seems that doesn't help me to go over the "Unable to Remap to Same Address as Parent" issue
[07:19] LouiseCiccone: That's because most people only know me by my psuedonym. :)
[07:19] Kingdutch: Which is?
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[07:20] creationix: I have pre-compiled cygwin binaries if you want
[07:20] creationix: for v0.2.6
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[07:20] creationix: bnitica: ^^
[07:20] bnitica: yes
[07:20] LouiseCiccone: Google knows.
[07:21] Kingdutch: creationix to the rescue! Even though it's cygwin
[07:21] LouiseCiccone: So anyone using ejs?
[07:21] Kingdutch: I see what you did there
[07:21] Kingdutch: LouiseCiccone, madonna, famous
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[07:21] LouiseCiccone: :)
[07:21] Kingdutch: And a node.js dev, thus a famous node.js dev
[07:21] Kingdutch: cute
[07:22] mjr_: It's funny to think of node devs as being "famous".
[07:23] Kingdutch: ryah is imo
[07:23] LouiseCiccone: 
ACTION wants to use ejs to replace some legacy php

[07:23] creationix: bnitica: just a sec, it's on my other machine
[07:23] SubStack: LouiseCiccone: also http://jspp.io/ 
[07:24] SubStack: pretty php-inspired
[07:24] bnitica: ok
[07:24] SubStack: if you want a more direct translation
[07:24] SubStack: jade is neat too
[07:25] LouiseCiccone: ejs looks the simplist
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[07:26] SubStack: dnode 0.5 out, now with .use() for middleware
[07:27] SubStack: cooking up some middlewares now
[07:27] chapel: cool SubStack
[07:27] chapel: you guys should check out dust
[07:28] SubStack: the django thing?
[07:28] creationix: bnitica: http://creationix.com/node-win32/node.exe
[07:28] chapel: no
[07:28] creationix: that's just the binary for 0.2.6
[07:28] LouiseCiccone: Anyone working on a bookmarking service in node.js?
[07:28] bnitica: thanks
[07:28] chapel: http://akdubya.github.com/dustjs/
[07:28] creationix: bnitica: get the rest from the cloud9 repo (their is 0.2.4 last I checked)
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[07:29] SubStack: a native node.exe? O_O
[07:29] creationix: bnitica: https://github.com/ajaxorg/node-builds
[07:29] creationix: SubStack: not hardly
[07:29] creationix: cygwin
[07:30] creationix: bnitica: note especially the /etc and /tmp folders on the ajaxorg repo, those are required for some things to work on windows
[07:30] pkrumins: soon there will be native
[07:30] creationix: pkrumins: that will be awesome
[07:30] pkrumins: at least ryah said so!
[07:31] pkrumins: i will use it for my awesome new world changing windows app framework
[07:31] bnitica: ok, thank you, I'll try it
[07:31] SubStack: still a long slog getting stuff to compile in windows for npm packages
[07:32] pkrumins: could do it like strawberry perl does!
[07:32] pkrumins: ships with mingw
[07:32] pkrumins: oh could be troublesome still
[07:32] pkrumins: yes trouble.
[07:32] creationix: yeah, I'm using node with cygwin dlls
[07:32] creationix: it works, but not well
[07:33] creationix: and paths are wonky
[07:33] pkrumins: so how is it in general
[07:33] pkrumins: can be used in practice?
[07:33] SubStack: maybe some add-on for npm for binary dll blobs
[07:33] pkrumins: or just to play around?
[07:33] creationix: I don't to native extensions, so that's not  a problem for me
[07:33] SubStack: and a build server and a pony
[07:33] pkrumins: SubStack: almost impossible
[07:34] pkrumins: SubStack: disregard that. 
[07:34] evanmeagher: can anyone suggest any code to check out for learning how to "properly" use streams for file downloading?
[07:34] evanmeagher: i'm wanting to add stream support for my dropbox api wrapper
[07:34] pkrumins: evanmeagher: how do you do it now?
[07:35] evanmeagher: hit the dropbox API directly and return file contents in a callback
[07:35] evanmeagher: would suck for huge files
[07:35] pkrumins: well doesn't it call 'data' event repeatedly?
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[07:37] evanmeagher: well, to be more precise, it's using a get request through node-oauth
[07:38] evanmeagher: pkrumins: the way I have it now works, as far as I know. I had a feature req for stream support though, so I'm looking into it
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[07:38] pkrumins: well you just have to listen on 'data' events somehow and save chunks that you get to file, that's it./2
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[07:39] evanmeagher: pkrumins: that's what i thought. it seems simple enough, and was wondering if i was missing something lol. thanks!
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[07:44] pkrumins: evanmeagher: you're welcome!
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[07:44] chapel: hmm
[07:44] SubStack: 
ACTION writes some tests

[07:44] SubStack: yay new modules
[07:45] chapel: pkrumins: isn't the data object a stream?
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[07:47] Fenda: hi :) is it possible for php to send and receive info from a nodejs server?
[07:47] Fenda: info=data*
[07:47] pkrumins: chapel: it's a buffer
[07:47] chapel: oh
[07:47] chapel: yeah hmm
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[07:47] chapel: well then the result is a stream no?
[07:48] mscdex: Fenda: sure, why not?
[07:48] SubStack: Fenda: lots of ways, what are you trying to do?
[07:49] mscdex: i find it funny that the PDF spec at adobe's site is only available in PDF format
[07:49] mscdex: :p
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[07:49] SubStack: if a virus wipes out all the pdf viewers we're fucked
[07:49] mscdex: heh
[07:49] pkrumins: chapel: emm, not sure how to explain
[07:49] Fenda: mscdex: SubStack: my system structure would be: browser requests page from apache server, apache requests related data from nodejs and uses this to build the page returned to the user
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[07:50] pkrumins: chapel: you'd have a http.ClientResponse, which is a Stream
[07:50] micheil: mscdex: those adobe guys must love recursion
[07:50] chapel: yes
[07:50] pkrumins: chapel: and you'd .on('data', function (chunk) { ... })
[07:50] chapel: response was the word
[07:50] chapel: yeah
[07:50] pkrumins: chapel: write that chunk to disk.
[07:50] chapel: and each chunk is a buffer
[07:50] pkrumins: yep
[07:50] chapel: I know that bit
[07:50] chapel: done that many gaimes
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[07:50] chapel: but the response is a stream
[07:50] pkrumins: so what is the bit you dont know?
[07:51] mscdex: i'm determined to learn the spec so i can write a much more complete pdf module
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[07:51] pkrumins: it's a readonly stream, yes.
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[07:51] chapel: well you shouldn't have to write to disk if response is a stream, and your function you want to send it to is a stream as well
[07:51] Fenda: mscdex: SubStack: a second scenario: browser sends post ajax to apache webserver, apache then forwards this data to nodejs + also a mysql db for storage
[07:51] mscdex: it's my new distraction away from distractions
[07:51] mscdex: :p
[07:51] chapel: concerning the guy with the dropbox api wrapper
[07:51] LouiseCiccone: mscdex: pdf module you say?
[07:52] mscdex: LouiseCiccone: yeah
[07:52] pkrumins: so he'd have to either hack that code to export a stream in easy way or find if they do it already
[07:52] pkrumins: the other way around
[07:52] SubStack: Fenda: any reason to keep the node.js side from directly talking to the browser?
[07:52] pkrumins: mscdex: you crayzy!
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[07:52] mscdex: nah
[07:52] chapel: yeah pkrumins
[07:52] chapel: if he is just downloading the file
[07:52] chapel: then its super simple
[07:52] mscdex: i've dealt with crazy binary protocol/format stuff before, so this isn't much different :)
[07:53] mscdex: it's just a little more complex
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[07:53] pkrumins: like 600 pages more of spec ;)
[07:53] micheil: mscdex: pdf's in node == hawt.
[07:53] SubStack: this module is pretty meta
[07:53] mscdex: 756 pages actually
[07:53] mscdex: :p
[07:53] pkrumins: SubStack: i heard you liked meta
[07:53] SubStack: "dnode middleware for processing web middleware stacks for socket.io"
[07:53] pkrumins: " ... over dnode"
[07:53] SubStack: I need it, I swear!
[07:54] pkrumins: make it recursive too
[07:54] SubStack: nah it doesn't actually depend on anything except seq
[07:54] pkrumins: which depends on chainsaw!
[07:54] sechrist has joined the channel
[07:54] SubStack: it does!
[07:54] mscdex: i'm still struggling to come up with a clever name for the module though
[07:55] mscdex: that's the important first step
[07:55] micheil: node-pdf would do.
[07:55] pkrumins: mscdex: node-pdf.
[07:55] SubStack: pkrumins: and chainsaw depends on traverse
[07:55] micheil: or, needyef
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[07:55] pkrumins: wat you say!
[07:55] SubStack: I am all about the long dependency chains
[07:55] pkrumins: your stack is deep
[07:55] Fenda: SubStack: in that case; browser requests page from apache server which returns that, then requests information from nodejs which returns that. i see that as 2 client->server calls.
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[07:56] Fenda: SubStack: the apache svr and nodejs are running on 2 boxes right next to eachother so if the apache + nodejs talk to eachother, there is only 1 needed client->server call
[07:56] mscdex: a lot of people complain about the "node-xxxx" module naming convention, that's why i was trying to come up with something else
[07:56] pkrumins: why do they complain!
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[07:56] mscdex: i'm not the one to ask :p
[07:56] Fenda: SubStack: also, i'd rather not setup mysql access from my nodejs to keep it simple
[07:56] pkrumins: ignore them ;)
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[07:57] mscdex: Fenda: why not just do it in PHP or something then? it sounds like you're not really going to be doing much with node
[07:57] mscdex: 
ACTION dodges the flames

[07:57] mscdex: :>
[07:58] mscdex: i mean you're already going through apache
[07:58] Fenda: mscdex: well my scenario above is only the initial page load. i'm using node with socket.io after this to process instant chat
[07:58] slaskis: mscdex: pdf.js
[07:58] slaskis: ?
[07:58] mscdex: slaskis: taken
[07:58] pkrumins: no 
[07:58] pkrumins: node-pdf
[07:58] SubStack: yeah it seems a bit backwards to use php for the proxying
[07:58] mscdex: Fenda: why for the initial page load?
[07:59] SubStack: Fenda: well then you're already connecting to the node server
[07:59] ivanfi has joined the channel
[07:59] SubStack: from the browser
[07:59] sechrist has joined the channel
[07:59] SubStack: just do that
[07:59] SubStack: browsers can connect to multiple servers
[08:00] SubStack: no need to add a needless layer of slow like php
[08:00] mscdex: or apache
[08:00] mscdex: :-D
[08:00] SubStack: yeah mostly apache
[08:00] Fenda: SubStack: mscdex: perhaps its easier to explain this way, check out facebook chat architecture google doc pg 19: http://tinyurl.com/24wjt6v
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[08:01] Fenda: i'm using this to 'some extent'. channel clusters + presence will be done all in nodejs, chatlogger = mysql, web tier = apache
[08:02] mscdex: that's fine, but like SubStack said, you don't need to proxy the connection
[08:02] SubStack: Fenda: do you have facebook-scale problems?
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[08:02] Fenda: SubStack: hell no :D
[08:02] SubStack: if not, you're not solving the same kinds of problems as facebook
[08:02] SubStack: and their solutions won't be terribly applicable
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[08:03] mscdex: yeah, they even resulted to mutating PHP
[08:03] mscdex: heh
[08:04] SubStack: automated AST php transforms
[08:04] SubStack: props for that
[08:04] Fenda: ok for now lets ignore my first scenario. the second scneario (message sends). if i want to stay clear of nodejs->mysql direct access
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[08:04] mscdex: what's the reasoning behind that restriction?
[08:05] Fenda: browser to apache ajax post the message, apache writes it to mysql, sends it to nodejs for broadcasting to relative sessions
[08:05] Fenda: mscdex: the mysql database runs on the apache machine
[08:05] SubStack: erm
[08:05] SubStack: socket.io is bidirectional
[08:05] mscdex: yikes
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[08:05] SubStack: you don't need any of that
[08:05] mscdex: yeah
[08:05] gaYak: Sounds like overengineering and problems.
[08:06] mscdex: fo realz yo
[08:06] Fenda: :P
[08:06] Fenda: SubStack: bidirectional?
[08:06] SubStack: Fenda: it sends and receives
[08:06] Fenda: SubStack: yes. but if i send to nodejs, then nodejs must take responsibility for DB writes yeah?
[08:07] mscdex: Fenda: only if you want persistence of what's going on
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[08:07] mscdex: like permanently
[08:07] SubStack: there are other ways to strap a database onto what you're building too
[08:08] SubStack: node does have database libs itself
[08:08] Fenda: SubStack: ill look into them thanks
[08:08] SubStack: but if you don't like those you can whip up a quick perl script or something that keeps open a connection to your node process and proxies the db stuff
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[08:08] SubStack: but that would be worse I think
[08:09] mscdex: yeah there's a plethora of database modules, mostly nosql though
[08:09] mjr_: Sometimes, there are multiple modules for a given nosql database.
[08:09] mjr_: That is how much we hate sql
[08:10] mscdex: but fwiw node-mysql exists and is async and generally works well
[08:10] mscdex: and is in active development
[08:10] Fenda: thanks
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[08:10] mscdex: and the author, felixge, frequents here
[08:10] Fenda: mscdex: i guess a persistency in the current node instant would be ok
[08:11] mscdex: i mean for short term stuff, you could easily keep an in-memory buffer or whatever
[08:11] mscdex: depending on your needs
[08:11] Fenda: yea
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[08:38] bingomanatee: Dont be hatin
[08:39] bingomanatee: I would point out that the fact that there are multiple modules for a given repository doesn't show how much you hate sql
[08:39] bingomanatee: it shows how little you understand about nosql
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[08:44] [AD]Turbo: yo all
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[08:51] tanepiper: woop!  some sanity around the url + querystring stuff staying in!
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[08:52] slickplaid: does anyone have a good example for username, email, etc. validation/sanitation I could look at?
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[08:52] tanepiper: Fenda: a good example of what substack says above is, when my nodejs app goes to shutdown, it pings all clients and on the clientside i pop up a modal box with the message passed to warn the user (and that's just a start)
[08:53] bingomanatee: most of that is going to be regex - centric and regular expressions can be found across the internet in various forms. 
[08:53] slickplaid: I'm using https://github.com/chriso/node-validator but the code i'm writing seems really... drawn out and not very optimized
[08:53] tanepiper: that's the power of sockets
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[08:53] bingomanatee: By the way - the spec for email addresses is VERY permissive as to what can be used to make up an email address - I think a lot of implementations are a lot more limited than the overarching email address spec.
[08:54] slickplaid: yeah, I agree
[08:54] SubStack: I just make sure there's an @
[08:54] bingomanatee: @@@.com
[08:54] bingomanatee: oh how badly I wish there was an @.com
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[08:55] slickplaid: if you could buy TLD's you could have a perfectly legal user@com or user@whatever
[08:55] bingomanatee: Mike T. of the PHP meetup was complaining that the URL filter in Zend_Framework was causing more problems than it solved because it was rejecting valid URLs. 
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[08:56] slickplaid: it's getting late and i think i should just worry about validation later... think i'm trying to count my chickens before they've hatched lol
[08:56] slickplaid: havent even finished the crud for it yet
[08:57] bingomanatee: point of all this being: you are best to do orioginal research at the w3c sites before you start evaluating filters for internet related filters. 
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[08:58] bingomanatee: there is an at.com but its horrid. 
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[08:58] bingomanatee: internet related terms. 
[08:59] slickplaid: ♠.com
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[09:00] slickplaid: ·.com
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[09:05] Fenda: anyone know an easier syntax for closeTimeout on all transports for socket.io, currently have this:
[09:05] Fenda: var io = io.listen(server, {transportOptions: {websocket: {closeTimeout: 10000}}, {flashsocket: {closeTimeout: 10000}}, {htmlfile: {closeTimeout: 10000}}, {xhr-multipart: {closeTimeout: 10000}}, {xhr-polling: {closeTimeout: 10000}}, {jsonp-polling: {closeTimeout: 10000}}});
[09:06] xer0x: zzz
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[09:54] SubStack: 965 modules on npm now!
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[09:54] SubStack: we should throw a party when it hits 1000
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[10:13] mAritz: SubStack: i'm sure you and jimbastard can throw 35 modules at it in 2-3 hours *duck'n'run* :D
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[10:33] SubStack: mAritz: as it happens I'm hacking up another module right now
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[10:38] tanepiper: this is pretty awesome: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YR3z3PHG3rI
[10:38] tanepiper: JavaScript FTW
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[11:03] Guest97418: hello, got an undocumented error when attemempting to make node.js
[11:05] Guest97418: got a: Build failed: -> task failed (err #-1):
[11:05] Guest97418: {task: cc ev.c -> ev_1.o}
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[11:07] Guest97418: anyone fancy helping out
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[11:10] djanowski: hello all. getting an ECONNREFUSED error, but the stack trace doesn't help (node's internals). any ideas on how to know exactly where in my code i'm trying to establish a connection?
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[11:43] saschagehlich: tanepiper: omg, awesome! :)
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[11:48] saschagehlich: tim_smart: did you already have a look at writing id3v2 tags?
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[12:13] SubStack: session middleware seems very broken
[12:13] SubStack: for every lib I try I always get a new random session ID on every page load
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[12:23] eirikb: Hey. If I want many instances of a 'class' in node, am I doing something wrong? I'm probably not using the CommonJS pattern, but does it really matter?
[12:24] SubStack: Does it work? If so, you're doing it right.
[12:26] eirikb: It will work with both CommonJS and not. Just that without CommonJS I can bundle more things within the 'class', and do myClasses[234].whatsup(), instead of require('myclasses').wahtsup(stuff)
[12:26] micheil: does anyone have anything for connecting to a server and executing node commands on it?
[12:26] micheil: (sort of like dnode, but not quite)
[12:27] eirikb: SubStack: Hmm, I guess I'll just do whatever works then, and I feel is prettiest (and pretty code is not my strong side)
[12:28] eirikb: SubStack: Thanks
[12:29] SubStack: micheil: do you need auth?
[12:29] micheil: SubStack: yes. something like ruby's Rush
[12:30] SubStack: a shell?
[12:30] micheil: http://rush.heroku.com/rdoc/
[12:30] micheil: yeah, sort of
[12:31] SubStack: so just ssh host 'node' ?
[12:31] eirikb: micheil: Here: http://pastebin.com/h7jmvr9L
[12:31] eirikb: micheil: Nothing bad can be done
[12:31] eirikb: micheil: Not at all.. promise
[12:31] eirikb: :D
[12:31] micheil: eirikb: heh, not going to even go there.
[12:32] eirikb: Tell me when you have it up and running ;)
[12:32] SubStack: micheil: also you can do auth in dnode with closures like this https://github.com/substack/dnode/blob/master/examples/auth/server.js 
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[12:32] SubStack: but a shell would be boss too
[12:32] micheil: eirikb: doesn't matter, you couldn't easily access it any way, it's behind an amazon firewall.
[12:33] eirikb: k
[12:33] SubStack: dnode(fs).listen(5050) !
[12:33] SubStack: would pretty much be this rush thing
[12:33] micheil: hmm, okay
[12:34] SubStack: except for the return values
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[12:34] SubStack: but some hacking could make those work if you know ahead of time what the return values are like
[12:34] micheil: trying to figure out node deployment in a better way then git deploys
[12:35] SubStack: me too
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[12:35] SubStack: hard problem
[12:35] micheil: SubStack: pm.
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[12:52] tanepiper: micheil: yea, i saw rush - i'd love to see a nodejs version of it, so you can right proper javascript commands for systems
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[13:12] SubStack: oh goodness, a JimBastard-style response middleware would let me write a kick-ass session lib
[13:14] SubStack: hacking that up real quick
[13:15] micheil: ?
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[13:15] SubStack: like this but for middlewares https://github.com/Marak/response
[13:15] foo-bar-: I'm having build issues on Windows XP using Cygwin, can anyone help?
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[13:16] torvalamo: foo-bar-, what
[13:16] torvalamo: which version
[13:16] foo-bar-: the error is "Task Failed  (err #2): {task: libv8.a SConstruct -> libv8.a}"
[13:16] foo-bar-: v0.3.6
[13:16] foo-bar-: I've tried export SHELL=/bin/bash
[13:16] torvalamo: 0.3.x doesn't build on cygwin
[13:16] foo-bar-: ahh
[13:16] foo-bar-: ok
[13:17] foo-bar-: does it build on windows at all?
[13:17] torvalamo: no
[13:17] niklasfi: i think i am doing something wrong how do i overrride bytes 3-14 of a file? https://gist.github.com/796663 <- this somehow changes the file size to 14 and prepends the x0's
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[13:17] torvalamo: they're working on it though, it'll be fine at 0.4
[13:17] foo-bar-: ok, sounds good
[13:17] foo-bar-: thanks
[13:17] torvalamo: coming within a few weeks we were told
[13:17] SubStack: crap I need to get some sleep soon too
[13:18] SubStack: but I have all these great code ideas I want to hack up
[13:18] torvalamo: make a list
[13:18] SubStack: on it!
[13:19] torvalamo: and then realize there's no way you can do all that, because as you're doing them you add 5 new things for every other line of code
[13:19] torvalamo: that's the problem with being creative
[13:20] SubStack: except these are all tiny well-defined problems right now
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[13:21] micheil: SubStack: is one of the items on that list an idea I gave you? :D
[13:21] SubStack: yes
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[13:22] micheil: cool.
[13:22] micheil: I think I've worked out my solution.
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[13:49] EGreg_: Hi.
[13:49] EGreg_: Is anyone here using node-facebook or some other facebook client with node?
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[13:54] micheil: yes!
[13:54] micheil: EGreg_: 
[13:54] micheil: the company I work for, Votizen, have just released their facebook client
[13:55] micheil: http://github.com/votizen/facebook-graph-client
[13:55] micheil: it's up on npm (or should be)
[13:56] micheil: we also have facebook-realtime-graph, for interacting with facebook's realtime Graph API
[13:56] Nomon: I just used the httpClient 
[13:57] Nomon: and if you need authentication throw in one of the oauth consumers for node :)
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[13:57] EGreg_: micheil! Great!
[13:57] EGreg_: let's see
[13:58] micheil: EGreg_: let me know if you need any help with it
[13:58] EGreg_: I have a question then
[13:58] micheil: okay
[13:58] EGreg_: I have an access token, can I issue POST requests to facebook's graph api?
[13:58] EGreg_: how do I post on a person's wall for example
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[13:59] micheil: yes
[13:59] micheil: oh, wait, read that wrong
[13:59] micheil: you need to use the connection on the facebook graph.
[13:59] micheil: one moment
[14:00] micheil: see the publishing section here: http://developers.facebook.com/docs/reference/api/post/
[14:00] EGreg_: have you seen node-facebook btw?
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[14:01] EGreg_: node-facebook-client, sorry
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[14:03] EGreg_: woohoo, I am reading your code
[14:03] EGreg_: but I am not sure, what is "id" in Client.prototype.postObject ?
[14:03] micheil: https://gist.github.com/91a4aa4f5854b798da48
[14:04] micheil: yeah, I saw each, but none implemented it in a way that I liked
[14:04] micheil: id is the user id
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[14:04] EGreg_: so how do I post on a user's wall
[14:04] micheil: it can either be a facebook user id, or, it can be "me"
[14:04] EGreg_: ah
[14:04] EGreg_: https://gist.github.com/91a4aa4f5854b798da48
[14:05] EGreg_: easy! thanks
[14:05] EGreg_: I don't suppose we can upload pictures with graph api yet, right
[14:05] EGreg_: (you may not know this)
[14:05] micheil: actually...
[14:05] micheil: whoops.
[14:05] Lorentz: Wooo facebook api in node
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[14:05] EGreg_: it should say .postConnection btw, not post_connection
[14:05] micheil: hmm, did the api change?
[14:06] EGreg_: can you explain what is this getObject vs getConnection ? What is the "conection of an object on the graph"
[14:06] EGreg_: why don't you just let me specify the path of the url
[14:06] micheil: okay, getConnection retrieves a specific connection on the graph
[14:06] micheil: where as getObject retrieves a specific object from the graph
[14:06] EGreg_: what if later, facebook will have a/b/c ?
[14:06] micheil: a connection belongs to an object
[14:06] EGreg_: 2/commonFriends/3
[14:06] EGreg_: for example
[14:07] micheil: if facebook's api changes later, I'll change the client.
[14:07] micheil: simple.
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[14:07] EGreg_: I think I will just use .request :)
[14:07] micheil: damn. I've gotta re-publish to npm.
[14:07] EGreg_: oh, you expose .request :) which is nice
[14:07] micheil: watch out there..
[14:07] EGreg_: okay, I'm sold
[14:07] Kingdutch: JS exposes everything
[14:08] micheil: I'd highly recommend using the actual methods, not just doing it with .request
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[14:08] EGreg_: client.request('post', 'me/post', args, callback)
[14:08] EGreg_: right?
[14:08] EGreg_: why is that?
[14:09] micheil: EGreg_: this is an early version of the module, so things might change as I start to use it more
[14:09] EGreg_: what is the license btw
[14:09] EGreg_: of the file
[14:09] micheil: well, simply because .request is just in there
[14:09] backthatzachup_ has joined the channel
[14:09] micheil: the license is in /LICENSE.md
[14:09] micheil: it's a MIT style license.
[14:09] EGreg_: does it allow commercial use?
[14:09] micheil: yes
[14:10] EGreg_: deal in the Software without restriction, ok
[14:10] EGreg_: Sounds good
[14:10] micheil: (although, really, if you sell just our work, we'd be kinda pissed, to tell you the truth)
[14:10] EGreg_: so how do I insall it? npm what
[14:10] micheil: but it can be solid within other projects
[14:10] EGreg_: nah I wouldn't sell your work lol, but I'd incorporate it in a program I am making
[14:10] EGreg_: which I might charge my client for
[14:10] micheil: that's fine then
[14:10] EGreg_: cool :)
[14:10] EGreg_: this is awesome, I can now implement my "broadcasting" app
[14:11] EGreg_: someone asked me to make an app for them where people will sign up on their website, that they can post on their wall
[14:11] micheil: you can either add it into a package.json as a dependency or you can do `npm install facebook-graph-client`
[14:11] EGreg_: and when they post, it gets syndicated on everyone's wall who opted in
[14:11] EGreg_: I want to use Node.js for the background process that actually posts
[14:11] Kingdutch: That's sooo annoying
[14:11] Kingdutch: If I find a service that does that I opt-out within 10 min.
[14:11] micheil: you'll probably need to use node-oauth and connect-auth for that as well
[14:11] backthatzachup_ has left the channel
[14:11] EGreg_: well some people want it I guess
[14:12] Kingdutch: No offense to you :) Just my .2$ 
[14:12] Kingdutch: .02$*
[14:12] EGreg_: maybe a club would post something on all promoters' walls
[14:12] EGreg_: or an organization
[14:12] micheil: EGreg_: if you get paid to make it, why not.?
[14:12] mnbvasd: 
ACTION sickers

[14:12] Kingdutch: Yeh agreed with Micheil
[14:12] EGreg_: micheil: why is that
[14:12] Kingdutch: If you can get paid for something, just do it
[14:12] EGreg_: micheil: I have a PHP facebook client, it already has the access token, I just have to pass it to Node
[14:12] mnbvasd: 2¢?
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[14:12] Kingdutch: Don't have that char
[14:12] micheil: well, generally anything with facebook is likely to attract money and investor attention at the moment
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[14:13] EGreg_: http://myownstream.com :)
[14:13] EGreg_: that's my project
[14:13] micheil: EGreg_: oh, I thought you were going to implement it all in node
[14:13] EGreg_: long-term I mean
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[14:13] micheil: if you already have the tokens, that's fine then.
[14:13] EGreg_: micheil: oh, no I use PHP for request serving, and Node.js for backend and socket.io
[14:13] EGreg_: I mean for services and socket.io
[14:13] micheil: as for being able to publish anytime, you'll need to request offline_access
[14:13] EGreg_: I communicate with Node usig simple POSTs
[14:13] EGreg_: on a firewalled port
[14:14] EGreg_: yep I am already doing that on the browser side
[14:14] micheil: good good
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[14:14] mnbvasd: Kingdutch: you don't have <alt gr>c ?
[14:14] EGreg_: wait, offline_access? or stream_post ?
[14:14] EGreg_: I thought stream_post encompasses offline_access
[14:14] mnbvasd: must be a damn foreign dutch keyboard? ;)
[14:14] micheil: offline_access
[14:14] EGreg_: let me check quickly
[14:15] Kingdutch: �
[14:15] Kingdutch: Copyright icon! :D
[14:15] EGreg_: woo hoo!
[14:15] mnbvasd: ok that's more relevant... how about with a c?
[14:15] mnbvasd: ermn shift
[14:15] Kingdutch: �
[14:15] Kingdutch: Oh there u are
[14:15] EGreg_: publish_stream	Enables your application to post content, comments, and likes to a user's stream and to the streams of the user's friends. With this permission, you can publish content to a user's feed at any time, without requiring offline_access. However, please note that Facebook recommends a user-initiated sharing model.
[14:15] micheil: EGreg_: let me just republish to npm..
[14:15] EGreg_: Aha, memory serves me well! :)
[14:15] Kingdutch: And it's the Logitech G11 Bought in the NL correct, but mapped to American English
[14:15] micheil: oh, well, there you go.
[14:16] micheil: I'm just used to having to need offline_access
[14:16] EGreg_: I doubt ha offline_access lets you publish the stream though
[14:16] EGreg_: also I wish fcacebook supported push for comments or something
[14:16] EGreg_: so when someone posts a comment to an xid, I get a ping about it
[14:16] EGreg_: I hate pulling comments
[14:16] micheil: EGreg_: multiple permissions
[14:16] EGreg_: because I have 10000000 xids
[14:17] EGreg_: but anyway, cool!
[14:17] micheil: EGreg_: check out the realtime graph for that. that's all I'll say there :)
[14:17] EGreg_: what is the npm id
[14:17] EGreg_: of your thing
[14:17] EGreg_: wait, really? realtimegraph?
[14:17] micheil: npm install facebook-graph-client
[14:17] EGreg_: can you link me?
[14:17] EGreg_: sweet! I like your client! Nice and simple.
[14:17] EGreg_: and what do I require?
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[14:19] micheil: yeah, http://developers.facebook.com/docs/api/realtime
[14:19] micheil: as for the realtime graph api, it's a bit more complicated.
[14:19] EGreg_: last I saw, the realtime graph supported only a few objects
[14:19] micheil: yeah
[14:20] EGreg_: let's see which ones. my browser is acting wonk
[14:20] EGreg_: y
[14:20] jacobolu_ has joined the channel
[14:20] micheil: but I've just noticed that the facebook docs have changed since yesterday
[14:20] EGreg_: ah it's kinda useless
[14:20] EGreg_: I wish they added one for omments
[14:20] EGreg_: on an xid
[14:20] Kingdutch: 
ACTION wants movie like graphics in games

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[14:20] Kingdutch: Like the actual cinematic style graphics :<
[14:20] micheil: EGreg_: one moment, just doing something, bbiam.
[14:21] EGreg_: okay thanks
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[14:22] micheil: argh. I love it when changes get made to files but not the tests >_>
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[14:24] niklasfi: i think i am doing something wrong how do i overrride bytes 3-14 of a file? https://gist.github.com/796663 <- this somehow changes the file size to 14 and prepends the x0's
[14:26] micheil: EGreg_: okay, `npm install facebook-graph-client`
[14:27] micheil: that's now reflecting the git source
[14:27] Kingdutch: 
ACTION just forgot what he wanted to do >.>

[14:27] micheil: EGreg_: also, the connection you want on the graph is "me/feed" according to the facebook documentation
[14:29] Kingdutch: Guys how much of a performance hit would it be if you implemented someway of classing like prototype has?
[14:29] micheil: probably not much
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[14:29] micheil: as to having that in node core? it'd be vetoed
[14:30] micheil: Kingdutch: try looking at other class systems too. eg, Class.js
[14:30] Kingdutch: I'm doubting, cause I read somewhere it was a performance hit, but it would increase development time
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[14:30] Kingdutch: Nah it'd be for client side mostly
[14:30] micheil: well, Class.js works for client side too.
[14:30] Kingdutch: Ruby style =/ never did ruby
[14:30] micheil: and doesn't extend the prototype object.
[14:30] micheil: well, prototype.js was originally from ruby too.
[14:31] Kingdutch: http://dailyjs.com/2010/03/11/framework-part-3-oo/
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[14:32] micheil: Kingdutch: yeah, what about it?
[14:34] Kingdutch: That's the way I think would be ok
[14:34] Kingdutch: Not sure if that's the ruby way
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[14:35] Qbix1: hi
[14:35] micheil: man. I should really get back into reading rss feeds.
[14:36] Qbix1: hey I downloaded npm facebook-graph-client
[14:37] Qbix1: what do I require() now?
[14:37] Qbix1: where did it install? I am new
[14:37] Qbix1: and how do I check what has been installed by npm so far
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[14:38] micheil: niklasfi: ?
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[14:39] micheil: well, the thing you require() is "facebook-graph-client"
[14:39] micheil: npm ls installed
[14:40] Qbix1: cool
[14:41] Qbix1: thanks!
[14:41] micheil: Qbix1: have a read through: http://nodejs.org/docs/v0.3.6/api/modules.html
[14:41] micheil: Qbix1: hmm, are you the same person as Kingdutch ?
[14:41] micheil: wait. EGreg_ 
[14:41] Kingdutch: No..
[14:41] micheil: not Kingdutch 
[14:42] Kingdutch: Jup
[14:42] Kingdutch: He's the same
[14:42] micheil: how'd you check?
[14:42] Kingdutch: /whois <namehere>
[14:42] Kingdutch: hostnames match
[14:43] micheil: hah, okay :D
[14:43] Kingdutch: Although
[14:43] Kingdutch: He does connect to two diff servers at the same time with two diff names, but hmm
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[14:53] hunterloftis: tj - I'm going to wrap formidable to support 'multiple' file fields. you want a connect-form pull request? 
[14:54] tiemonster: piscisaureus: are you around? have a sec to chat?
[14:54] tjholowaychuk: hunterloftis: yeah sure
[14:55] piscisaureus: tiemonster: I'm here
[14:55] tjholowaychuk: hunterloftis: sucks that he wont do it with his api
[14:55] tjholowaychuk: micheil: yoooo
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[14:57] tiemonster: piscisaureus: I got Node.js to compile on 32-bit XP
[14:57] piscisaureus: tiemonster: that's good
[14:57] piscisaureus: :-)
[14:57] tiemonster: unfortunately, I get this error when trying to run Node: http://pastie.org/1497391
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[14:57] tiemonster: I'm going to try to recompile again and make sure I didn't jack anything up
[14:58] mnbvasd: :0 oops.
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[14:58] piscisaureus: tiemonster: the first errors can be ignored. it means that you have no ipv6 stack on your machine
[14:58] piscisaureus: (that error message should go away in the future, keeping it there for debugging now)
[14:59] piscisaureus: but this process.; error is very weird
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[14:59] piscisaureus: i think you may need to update, it may have to do with some assert() filtering patch that ryah landed last night and backed out shortly thereafter because it caused problems
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[15:00] tiemonster: OK. Give me a sec.
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[15:03] tiemonster: piscisaureus: looks good. I ran make test and it looks like it fails every one, though...
[15:04] piscisaureus: tiemonster: heh. funny.
[15:04] piscisaureus: does the repl prompt work?
[15:04] tiemonster: what's a quick test I can do?
[15:04] piscisaureus: I think this error message confuses the test runner
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[15:05] tiemonster: the winsock one?
[15:05] piscisaureus: yeah.
[15:05] Kingdutch: Ok time for some coffee and to see if I can get a job
[15:05] Kingdutch: bbiab
[15:05] piscisaureus: if you comment out these lines: https://github.com/ry/node/blob/master/src/platform_win32_winsock.cc#L394-395
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[15:05] piscisaureus: I think the error messages will go away
[15:05] hunterloftis_: tjholowaychuk: Yeah I know, I thought it actually was since in the example he's using a multifile... but if you choose multiple, it just gives you the last one.
[15:06] piscisaureus: tiemonster: ^^
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[15:10] tiemonster: piscisaureus: trying it now. I was able to get the hello world example working.
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[15:10] tiemonster: piscisaureus: have you successfully built on 64-bit windows yet? I'm wondering if that could have been some of my woes...
[15:10] piscisaureus: tiemonster: you should be able to run node_chat (see http://github.com/ry/node_chat) as well
[15:11] piscisaureus: tiemonster: I'm running 64bit windows 7 myself
[15:11] tiemonster: hmm. so it must have been that msvc problem.
[15:11] piscisaureus: mingw32 creates a 32 bit build though
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[15:11] tiemonster: have you filed a ticket with V8 about that?
[15:11] piscisaureus: tiemonster: the v8 team knows about it
[15:11] tiemonster: cool
[15:12] piscisaureus: tiemonster: but I'm not so sure that they will do something about it
[15:12] tiemonster: so Node runs without error, but all unit tests still fail as far as I can tell.
[15:12] piscisaureus: well, not all should fail
[15:12] piscisaureus: for me ~40 fail and the rest passes
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[15:13] piscisaureus: if all fail, then there must be something wrong with the test runner
[15:13] tiemonster: Path: message/hello_world
[15:13] tiemonster: The filename, directory name, or volume label syntax is incorrect.
[15:13] tiemonster: Command: c:\node\build\default\node.exe c:\node\test\message\hello_world.js
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[15:13] piscisaureus: python uissue
[15:14] piscisaureus: if you run that by hand it should work
[15:14] tiemonster: "This application has failed to start because libpthread-2.dll was not found..."
[15:14] piscisaureus: running from mingw console?
[15:14] torvalamo: you may need double backslash
[15:14] torvalamo: depending on the console
[15:15] tiemonster: never mind. got it.
[15:15] tiemonster: torvalamo++
[15:15] v8bot:  tiemonster has given a beer to torvalamo. torvalamo now has 1 beers.
[15:15] tiemonster: double backslash
[15:15] torvalamo: i have 3 in the fridge
[15:15] torvalamo: but thanks
[15:15] tiemonster: lol
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[15:15] bradleymeck: does anyone know of a lazy sort in js (sorts as w/e it returns iterates rather than doing a full on sort for some performance on long lived and big objects)?
[15:16] piscisaureus: tiemonster: so *all* tests failed?
[15:16] tiemonster: piscisaureus: anyways, now that we have a somewhat stable build, we'll see what we can do about the setenv/unsetenv stuff for Win32
[15:16] piscisaureus: ok. if you get it done, I will give you a more challenging job :-)
[15:16] piscisaureus: heh
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[15:17] torvalamo: took you two days to get it to compile in mingw?
[15:17] tiemonster: piscisaureus: [00:07|% 100|+   0|- 167]: Done
[15:17] piscisaureus: tiemonster: clearly a test runner issue. It doesn't even start node or it wouldn't be done in 7 seconds
[15:18] russ_nyc: tjholowaychuk: any ideas on issue 68? https://github.com/visionmedia/expresso/issues#issue/68
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[15:18] piscisaureus: tiemonster: u need SetEnvironmentVariableW (so the unicode version)
[15:18] tiemonster: what does that mean?
[15:18] tiemonster: oh - Win32 API calls?
[15:18] piscisaureus: yup
[15:18] tjholowaychuk: russ_nyc: hmm not sure off hand
[15:18] tiemonster: gotcha
[15:18] tjholowaychuk: russ_nyc: it does try to run them as soon as any are available
[15:18] tiemonster: 
ACTION runs to get something to take notes

[15:19] piscisaureus: tiemonster: there are logs too, heh.
[15:19] tjholowaychuk: russ_nyc: that feature is kinda half-assed
[15:19] tjholowaychuk: hell expresso in general is kinda half-assed haha I should be rewritting it sometime in the next few months
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[15:20] russ_nyc: tjholowaychuk: i also get the same behavior if I have them in seperate files but run the suite
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[15:21] russ_nyc: this means that i can get accurate code coverage and that i have to put one test per file and run each file seperately.  makes testing kinda slow :)
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[15:21] russ_nyc: tjholowaychuk: are there any other node testing frameworks that will work until you get expresso rewritten?
[15:21] tjholowaychuk: well just dont use async exports
[15:22] russ_nyc: i kinda have to because I use redis and mongo and my entire app is async
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[15:22] russ_nyc: unless i can force the redis and mongo drivers to be synchronous
[15:22] micheil: tjholowaychuk: expresso does work.. though
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[15:23] djanowski: russ_nyc: vows
[15:23] micheil: atleast, we're using it in our opensource projects
[15:23] Sembiance: russ_nyc
[15:23] tiemonster: piscisaureus: are there any unit tests written for process.setenv and process.unsetenv?
[15:23] russ_nyc: im not knowcking it
[15:23] russ_nyc: i love how its set up, its just the async part
[15:23] tjholowaychuk: micheil: its just not feature complete, it was a big hack haha
[15:23] Sembiance: russ_nyc: in which way did you split upi your data between mongo/redis? What data are you storing in redis vs mongo? Just curious :)
[15:23] micheil: oh. what's missing?
[15:23] tjholowaychuk: the exports bite you as well for the issue russ is having
[15:23] tjholowaychuk: but ive never personally had that issue
[15:24] piscisaureus: tiemonster: test-process-env mayble
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[15:24] tjholowaychuk: vows is lame, expresso is lame
[15:24] tjholowaychuk: much better ideas in mind haha
[15:24] tjholowaychuk: just need time
[15:24] russ_nyc: Sembiance: i use redis for queueing and for quick access, it is much faster than mongo for puts
[15:24] micheil: ohh.. async exports in tests
[15:24] bradleymeck: tj just needs clones
[15:24] russ_nyc: tjholowaychuk: id love to contribute
[15:25] piscisaureus: tiemonster: though that test may fail due to child process issues too atm
[15:25] tjholowaychuk: i like the simplicity of using the exports but it does kinda suck for that
[15:25] tjholowaychuk: most libraries queue commands internally though so it ends up not being a problem
[15:25] djanowski: tjholowaychuk: i'd like to know why you don't like vows
[15:26] tiemonster: piscisaureus: thanks for your help setting things up. I hope we're able to make a decent contribution.
[15:26] tjholowaychuk: djanowski: because i dont like one key, and one callback per assertion
[15:26] tjholowaychuk: it does nothing that i actually want lol
[15:26] djanowski: tjholowaychuk: agreed, that kinda sucks
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[15:30] piscisaureus: tiemonster: np
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[15:33] tiemonster: piscisaureus: if I get bored, I'll at least see if I can find a way to trap for msvc errors and report back a better error message
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[15:33] piscisaureus: tiemonster: I guess you can fix that env stuff pretty quick
[15:34] piscisaureus: but there's a lot more that can be done
[15:34] tiemonster: um, we're going to take two weeks ;-)
[15:34] piscisaureus: tiemonster: that's gonna be ~ 2 days for each line of code :-)
[15:34] tiemonster: me personally, I'd love to help - in ways that don't require windows
[15:35] tiemonster: piscisaureus: I'm also going to look into the msvc stuff, and see if I can figure out the test runner issue
[15:35] piscisaureus: tiemonster++
[15:35] v8bot:  piscisaureus has given a beer to tiemonster. tiemonster now has 1 beers.
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[15:37] garrensmith: If I cant to cancel a submit do I return false from the onclick event of a submit button?
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[15:38] torvalamo: no
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[15:38] garrensmith: torvalamo:  is there a way to cancel it then?
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[15:38] shiawuen: garrensmith: return false for form submit
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[15:39] garrensmith: shiawuen: sorry what do you mean?
[15:39] Anti-X: <form onsubmit="return false;">
[15:39] shiawuen: when you click submit button, the form trigger submit event
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[15:40] garrensmith: Anti-X: awesome thanks perfect
[15:40] Anti-X: it's not awesome
[15:40] Anti-X: it's an ugly hack
[15:41] Anti-X: if you don't want to submit you shouldn't have a submit button
[15:41] Anti-X: simple as that
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[15:41] garrensmith: Anti-X: I want to do some validation on the inputs or is there a better way of doing it?
[15:42] tiemonster: make a submit event handler, and return false if there's an error
[15:43] garrensmith: tiemonster: thanks that a better idea. I will do that
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[15:43] Anti-X: you need to return from that also
[15:44] Anti-X: <form onsubmit="return sumbitEventHandler()">
[15:44] Anti-X: not just return false inside the function
[15:44] tiemonster: or use jQuery
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[15:45] garrensmith: tiemonster: I'm going to use jquery, nice and easy
[15:45] tiemonster: $('#form-id').submit(function() { //validation ... return false; });
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[15:47] garrensmith: cool thanks for the help guys, all working :-)
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[15:49] bradleymeck: wasnt there a throwaway dev thing like jsfiddle for node?
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[15:51] Anti-X: throwaway dev
[15:51] Anti-X: sounds like "the new guy at work"
[15:52] tiemonster: the mechanical turk of programming
[15:52] tiemonster: things are getting that way with PHP work...
[15:53] tiemonster: I met a guy who pretends to be Bangladeshi on job boards so he can win contracts
[15:53] bradleymeck: yep, but i just need to see if a port of mine got blocked :/
[15:53] devdazed: does anyone know how i would send a blank 1x1 pixel using http, without accessing the filesystem?
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[15:53] bradleymeck: define blank and what filetype you want
[15:54] devdazed: png and invisible
[15:54] tiemonster: devdazed: make it, then store the binary equivalent wherever you want
[15:54] devdazed: gif will work also
[15:55] devdazed: tiemonster: how would I store the binary equivalent in a .js file?
[15:55] tiemonster: as a string?
[15:55] Anti-X: the most reasonable way would be to make a 1x1px file and then access it on startup and put it in memory
[15:55] bradleymeck: buffer is better due to possible f ups in utf
[15:55] Anti-X: and serve it from there
[15:56] devdazed: ok
[15:56] bradleymeck: agree anti-x
[15:56] Anti-X: you could store it as base64
[15:56] Anti-X: actually that can be made from within a browser
[15:56] Anti-X: make a 1x1 canvas
[15:56] Anti-X: and toData it
[15:56] Anti-X: or something
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[15:57] Anti-X: afaik that's png format
[15:58] devdazed: hmm, thanks for your help all. I think that reading it from disk on startup might be the way to go. this way it might avoid any potential problems
[16:01] tiemonster: devdazed: pixel = 'R0lGODdhAQABAIAAAP///////ywAAAAAAQABAAACAkQBADs=';
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[16:02] devdazed: tiemonster: how would i send that across in the http send mthod?
[16:02] tiemonster: just base64 decode it before you chuck it at the browser, and make sure you set the right mimetype
[16:02] devdazed: nice
[16:02] devdazed: thanks abunch
[16:02] tiemonster: have fun!
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[16:02] tiemonster: happy spamming!
[16:02] devdazed: haha, not spamming, adserving. but there isn't much difference is there :)
[16:03] Anti-X: data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAAAEAAAABCAYAAAAfFcSJAAAADUlEQVQImWNgYGBgAAAABQABh6FO1AAAAABJRU5ErkJggg==
[16:03] Anti-X: 1px transparent png
[16:03] tiemonster: mine's smaller
[16:04] Anti-X: / is not base64
[16:04] Anti-X: anyways
[16:04] Anti-X: mine can be used in a <img tag
[16:04] tiemonster: oh. I see.
[16:04] Anti-X: <img src="data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAAAEAAAABCAYAAAAfFcSJAAAADUlEQVQImWNgYGBgAAAABQABh6FO1AAAAABJRU5ErkJggg==">
[16:04] Anti-X: :)
[16:04] tiemonster: python has two base64 functions
[16:05] devdazed: Anti-X: it cant be browser based
[16:05] devdazed: i dont control the html, i just server the image
[16:05] piscisaureus: Anti-X: does not work with IE
[16:05] tiemonster: Anti-X: the whole point is that he's catching impressions on the Node side
[16:05] Anti-X: it's hypothetical
[16:05] Anti-X: i thought we solved his problem ages ago
[16:05] Anti-X: on irc, we first solve problems, then we optimize
[16:06] Anti-X: piscisaureus, not ie9 either?
[16:06] piscisaureus: that I don't know
[16:07] strmpnk has joined the channel
[16:07] piscisaureus: IE 9 does not exist
[16:07] Anti-X: the plus side of this approach though is that it reduces the amount of requests to the server
[16:07] Anti-X: by 1 per page view, sans caching
[16:08] devdazed: Anti-X: 'R0lGODdhAQABAIAAAP///////ywAAAAAAQABAAACAkQBADs=' does decode as a 1x1px gif
[16:08] Anti-X: oh a gif
[16:08] Anti-X: that's always smaller
[16:08] andrzejsliwa has joined the channel
[16:08] Anti-X: but not sexy
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[16:09] devdazed: but it is valid base64
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[16:09] Anti-X: yes it works for me too
[16:09] wao: nah
[16:09] wao: devdazed: stfu
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[16:09] wao: sry, it was just hilightin me :p
[16:10] Anti-X: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Base64
[16:10] Anti-X: / is not in the list...
[16:11] devdazed: value 63 = /
[16:11] Anti-X: damn
[16:11] Anti-X: i must be blind
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[16:42] rjrodger: devdazed: I do this using a Buffer, passing in an array of bytes encoding the gif, and then response.end(imgbuf,'binary')
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[16:45] devdazed: rjrodger: do you happen to have an example?  im not familiar with how to use buffers in node, let alone how to load an image into them
[16:45] rjrodger: hold on...
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[16:50] rjrodger: https://gist.github.com/796988
[16:51] devdazed: rjrodger: thanks! that helps a lot!
[16:51] rjrodger: hah! safari says its a 0x0 gif - sweet!
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[16:55] torvalamo: binary encoding is deprecated
[16:56] torvalamo: just skip that argument for buffers (i think)
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[16:56] rjrodger: torvalamo: so binary is the default? since 0.3?
[16:56] torvalamo: no
[16:57] torvalamo: binary is not the same as buffer
[16:57] rjrodger: ah - it recognizes the Buffer obj and does the right thing!
[16:57] torvalamo: Right Thing TM
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[16:59] rjrodger: fixed - now safari thinks it's a 1x1 - hmm...
[16:59] torvalamo: isn't it?
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[16:59] devdazed: yeah, it shows as a 1x1 in mine also
[16:59] torvalamo: it was because it didn't get image data
[16:59] torvalamo: it got something else
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[17:00] tiemonster: 1x1 gif with 1dpi resolution ;-)
[17:00] rjrodger: lol - it never worked :)
[17:01] rjrodger: does now
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[17:04] torvalamo: why do you have a variable with the array, which is then only used once? you could just put the array directly in the buffer
[17:05] torvalamo: save the memory used by those 43 array elements that will stay in memory until exit
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[17:06] torvalamo: nitpick - my middle name
[17:08] torvalamo: oh it's used for content-length, but the buffer has that too
[17:08] podman: anyone play around with zombie.js at all?
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[17:09] rjrodger: torvalamo: true dat
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[17:09] fission6: was there a module called utils? in node.js at somepoint and if so what happened to it
[17:09] devdazed: its util
[17:09] micheil: fission6: it's called util
[17:09] micheil: was formly sys
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[17:10] micheil: I think there is an npm module called node-utils
[17:10] fission6: how come i get complaints it cnt be foudn, such as Error: Cannot find module 'utils'
[17:10] Kingdutch: sys and util are different, no?
[17:10] Kingdutch: fission6: because it's 'util' not 'utils'
[17:10] micheil: sys and util are pretty much the same, or should be the same
[17:10] Kingdutch: Oh
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[17:11] micheil: it's just a rename, as sys was a shite name
[17:11] fission6: looking at this line, https://github.com/assaf/zombie/blob/master/src/zombie/resources.coffee#L11
[17:11] micheil: that code is wrong then.
[17:11] fission6: so this is a different module
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[17:11] devdazed: inspect = require("util").inspect
[17:12] devdazed: yes the code is wrong
[17:12] micheil: util.inspect is a method.
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[17:12] torvalamo: it could be that they made it for 0.2.x, and added 'utils' as an alias to sys, and got it wrong
[17:12] torvalamo: for forwards compatibility
[17:13] fission6: thanks
[17:13] andrzejsliwa has joined the channel
[17:13] fission6: fixed
[17:13] podman: man, i can never get npm to work
[17:13] vineyard: is express mature enough to challenge rails? :o
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[17:13] vineyard: should i pick express over rails for a new project?
[17:13] torvalamo: yes
[17:13] podman: vineyard: depends on the project
[17:13] torvalamo: always go with what other people say
[17:14] vineyard: torvalamo: i'm not going with anything, i'm just looking for opinions kthx
[17:14] vineyard: never hurts to gain other views, too
[17:14] torvalamo: maybe you should rephrase the question then
[17:15] torvalamo: since it's impossible to answer
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[17:15] vineyard: torvalamo: why's that?
[17:15] torvalamo: some projects shouldn't use frameworks
[17:15] eresair has joined the channel
[17:16] torvalamo: some projects may benefit from rails specifics
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[17:16] torvalamo: some may benefit from express
[17:16] devdazed: we use a combination of rails (for our fron-end) and express for our high load server
[17:16] tjholowaychuk: vineyard: express is almost the opposite of rails
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[17:17] devdazed: maily because our front end doesnt require the performance and rails makes development nice and easy
[17:17] tjholowaychuk: rails = does lots for you, harder to tame, slow.  express = does less for you, easy to tame, fast
[17:17] amerine has joined the channel
[17:17] torvalamo: it's easy to tame rails
[17:17] torvalamo: just delete it
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[17:17] devdazed: hahaha
[17:17] micheil: vineyard: if you are a confident node.js programmer, then it would make sense to work with express or another framework
[17:18] devdazed: vineyard: if development time is a constraint and performance is not, then rails is the way to go
[17:18] micheil: (or atleast, if I were to start a new web application / site, I would now be developing it in node)
[17:18] amerine has joined the channel
[17:18] tjholowaychuk: i dont feel comfortable with anything BUT node now
[17:18] tjholowaychuk: haha
[17:19] podman: it seems like npm fails at permissions
[17:19] devdazed: podman: i had some of these issues, it works best if both node and npm are NOT sudo installed
[17:20] podman: devdazed: i don't *think* i installed either using sudo.
[17:20] torvalamo: you need root to run npm, so npm can tell you to not run as root
[17:20] devdazed: which package are you trying to install?
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[17:20] podman: devdazed: zombie.js
[17:21] vineyard: alright guys, thanks for the responses :)
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[17:21] devdazed: it did a clean install for me, make sure that node isn't installed as root
[17:21] podman: devdazed: ah, somehow, /usr/local/Cellar/node/0.2.6/share/man/man7 is owned by root
[17:21] podman: everything else is not
[17:21] podman: weird
[17:22] micheil: podman: /usr/local can easily be owned by your user
[17:22] micheil: which is what npm suggests, iirc.
[17:22] daniellindsley has joined the channel
[17:22] micheil: it's also what homebrew suggests, iirc.
[17:22] podman: micheil: yeah, i'm pretty sure i did a chown -R
[17:23] fangel has joined the channel
[17:23] podman: yeah, it was that single directory
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[17:23] podman: very strange.
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[17:23] podman: anyway, it's working now. thanks!
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[17:24] devdazed: np
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[17:26] podman: hmm, now zombie seems unhappy.
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[17:27] torvalamo: have you ever seen a happy zombie?
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[17:27] podman: torvalamo: good point.
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[17:38] tanepiper: dstufft: ping (Higgs here)
[17:38] dstufft: heyo
[17:38] brianc: podman: last I tried npm did not really behave when it was installed via homebrew or when node was installed via homebrew
[17:38] brianc: started using tjholowaychuk's "n" for managing node binarys and npm works like a charm now
[17:39] broofa has joined the channel
[17:39] brianc: that was a while ago though, npm may work better with homebrew installed node nowadays
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[17:44] tanepiper: this is pretty cool: http://agnoster.github.com/nodeready/
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[17:46] nooder: hello. anyone wants to participate in dev torrent server? https://github.com/anhel/node-bittorrent-tracker
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[17:49] micheil: what do people think? http://cl.ly/1t0840220i1M3i0i1v1t #docs
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[17:50] ryah: micheil: looks good. syntax highlighting needs help
[17:50] micheil: ryah: yeah, just had the idea to show the arguments in tables like that.
[17:51] micheil: so far that's just been edited in safari..
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[17:51] tjholowaychuk: orangeeee
[17:51] micheil: ryah: do you know if isaac will be about today?
[17:52] micheil: ryah: the orange is quite nice, but there's too much of it.
[17:52] tanepiper: starting to look like proper docs :)
[17:52] gkatsev: tjholowaychuk: btw, I saw your tweet about android and java. Well, you can use jython or scala or a lot of other jvm languages. Possibly even rhino :)
[17:52] tjholowaychuk: gkatsev: i forgot about phonegap :) haha
[17:52] tjholowaychuk: havent tried it out yet
[17:52] gkatsev: that also exists
[17:52] gkatsev: there are a few such things
[17:52] sechrist has joined the channel
[17:53] gkatsev: but yeah, no need to dirty yourself with java to make android games :)
[17:53] tanepiper: tjholowaychuk: what you doing with android?
[17:53] tjholowaychuk: tanepiper: probably a github app
[17:54] micheil: ryah: some how though, I don't think I'll force documentation writers to have to write markdown tables.. *shudders*
[17:54] micheil: I think I'll use jsdoc style argument definitions
[17:54] gkatsev: tjholowaychuk: fwiw: http://www.appbrain.com/app/hubroid/org.idlesoft.android.hubroid
[17:55] tjholowaychuk: oh cool :)
[17:55] tanepiper: tjholowaychuk: ndk for 2.3 looks pretty good, if you want to do stuff in c/c++
[17:55] tjholowaychuk: i cant get 2.3 yet apparently
[17:55] sechrist has joined the channel
[17:55] gkatsev: what phone do you have?
[17:55] tjholowaychuk: 2.1 is kinda lame, figured google could do better
[17:56] tjholowaychuk: HTC legend
[17:56] tjholowaychuk: its ok
[17:56] gkatsev: also, sure you could, just get cyanogenmod
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[17:56] mscdex: micheil: looks pretty good. it would be nice to have what the return values are
[17:56] gkatsev: though, 2.3 is in the nightlies of cyanogen
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[17:56] ryah: micheil: i'd rather not force people to write markdown tables
[17:56] ryah: micheil: sounds annoying
[17:57] micheil: ryah: something like: https://gist.github.com/797115
[17:57] tanepiper: mscdex: what are you using to gen the docs?  I need to doc my code and get some docs out
[17:57] tanepiper: eh, micheil 
[17:57] micheil: then I can have the doctool convert them to html tables.
[17:57] mscdex: heh :)
[17:57] ryah: micheil: that's fine. how about Param: instead of @param
[17:57] micheil: (we already use the @ symbol else where in the doctool, for the includes
[17:57] ryah: ah, ok
[17:57] micheil: both of which can be changed
[17:58] gnrfan has joined the channel
[17:58] micheil: although, your less likely to write /^@param/ then /^Param:/
[17:58] micheil: I think.
[17:58] liar has joined the channel
[17:58] micheil: but both work.
[17:58] ryah: we could also just change back to asciidoc :)
[17:58] mscdex: @return !
[17:58] mscdex: :p
[17:58] micheil: I think I'll switch to /^Param:/
[17:58] micheil: mscdex: returns should be described in the body of the function.
[17:59] micheil: body of the documentation.
[17:59] micheil: erm, description of the method.
[17:59] mscdex: well, the parameters could also
[17:59] mscdex: but they're separate
[17:59] micheil: but not in a concise way like that.
[17:59] mscdex: ;-)
[17:59] cronopio has joined the channel
[17:59] tanepiper: oooh, i've been approached about a potential nodejs job!
[17:59] Kingdutch: return values should be below the params
[17:59] Kingdutch: Atleast that's how I've always seen docs
[17:59] mscdex: it's easier to spot the return value if it's extracted
[18:00] isaacs has joined the channel
[18:00] Kingdutch: ^
[18:00] mscdex: along with the data type
[18:00] micheil: tanepiper: oh?
[18:00] sechrist has joined the channel
[18:00] micheil: mscdex: hmm.., ryah your call on this one I think.
[18:01] bingomanateeIpho has joined the channel
[18:01] cronopio: Hi all you!! Noders!!! :)
[18:01] mscdex: cronopio: greetings Earthling.
[18:01] bingomanatee: Hello, People? who. Don't: get? Puncutiation!
[18:01] tanepiper: micheil: yea, SaaS platform, sounds like they have some stuff already in the works, but they need another nodejs backend person
[18:01] sechrist has joined the channel
[18:01] micheil: sweet
[18:02] isaacs: lukegalea: you can use `npm bundle <do stuff>` to install things into ./node_modules.  or, if you prefer to be much more explicit, `npm install something --root $PWD/modules --binroot $PWD/bin --manroot $PWD/man`
[18:02] cronopio: mscdex: :D
[18:02] tjholowaychuk: micheil: appretiate your doc work man :) aside from the crazy orange the new structure is nice
[18:02] micheil: tjholowaychuk: hey, the crazy orange isn't my doing :P
[18:03] tjholowaychuk: appreciate*, haha no worries
[18:03] micheil: isaacs: needed to talk to you about some stuff, got a few minutes?
[18:03] isaacs: yes!
[18:03] tjholowaychuk: micheil: do you know why its all green/orange now?
[18:03] isaacs: what's up?
[18:04] micheil: tjholowaychuk: not at all
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[18:08] dstufft: hmm
[18:08] dstufft: nvm doesn't work in zsh apparently
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[18:08] tjholowaychuk: dstufft: try 'n'
[18:08] tjholowaychuk: it may or may not work
[18:08] tjholowaychuk: haha
[18:08] tjholowaychuk: i believe some zsh people use it
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[18:11] dstufft: actually it appears to work if you expert NVM_DIR
[18:11] dstufft: export
[18:12] dstufft: looking at ~/.nvm/nvm.sh, it uses some bash specific stuff to automagically detect NVM_DIR
[18:13] tjholowaychuk: hm
[18:13] dstufft: but before it does it checks 
[18:13] dstufft: if NVM_DIR exists
[18:14] dstufft: so just exporting that before sourcing the shell file seems to work
[18:14] bingomanatee: Noogle (http://narrative.io:3000/) is now populated with the "most awesome words" list - see if your favorite word is considered awesome by noders!
[18:15] bradleymeck: 3 wins! as it always should
[18:15] colinclark has joined the channel
[18:16] tjholowaychuk: bingomanatee: sort em :)
[18:16] sechrist has joined the channel
[18:16] tjholowaychuk: haha "3"
[18:16] tjholowaychuk: oOoO
[18:16] bingomanatee: eh. 
[18:16] bingomanatee: yeah. 
[18:16] bingomanatee: its a magaic number
[18:16] bingomanatee: And they are sorted. Alphabetically. 
[18:17] bingomanatee: Not that that makes sense in this context but... :D
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[18:19] lukegalea: isaacs: Thanks. I got your email. Think it'll all work out ;)
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[18:20] mscdex: sechrist needs to build an ark
[18:20] isaacs: lukegalea: oh, kewl.  i'm never sure if the irc logs match up exactly with the questions on the ML
[18:20] isaacs: or issues posted, etc.
[18:20] isaacs: a lot of times the same person has a question as someone else
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[18:21] lukegalea: Yep. Thanks for your help. Next time I bug you via email I'll add a reference to my irc request to avoid confusion.
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[18:22] dstufft: any particular editor have any decent support for writing apps in node.js?
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[18:23] AlexMax: most editors have javascript highlighting
[18:23] lukegalea: dstufft: Ya. I wonder that myself.
[18:23] AlexMax: what exactly are you looking for?
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[18:24] dstufft: AlexMax: tab complete for things would be cool, dunno if that's available, i'm typically a python dev, trying out node.js
[18:24] lukegalea: dstufft: I'm getting by with redcar and/or emacs. But they just do syntax highlighting.. and redcar is quite bad at it.
[18:25] warz: i tend to use eclipse, but have been meaning to try out http://kodapp.com/
[18:26] mscdex: real developers don't need tab completion!
[18:26] mscdex: :-D
[18:26] mscdex: that'd be kinda hard to do though
[18:27] mscdex: for javascript
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[18:30] ryah: so, im going to push crypto bindings out of node (not tls just the sign, verify, hmac, hash stuff)
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[18:30] ryah: i'll make an external module for it
[18:31] micheil: okay. just as long as it gets maintained.
[18:31] ryah: im not going to maintain it
[18:31] micheil: ryah: if you want, I'll remap / setup the docs for it.
[18:31] ryah: i'll do that
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[18:31] micheil: okay
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[18:33] tjholowaychuk: ryah: nooooo!
[18:33] tjholowaychuk: lol
[18:33] tjholowaychuk: dont remove that :(
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[18:34] mscdex: tjholowaychuk: i second that
[18:35] ryah: sorry
[18:35] micheil: crypto module is some nasty stuff.. way too big imho.
[18:36] ryah: yes
[18:36] ryah: also we need to start giving some love to modules
[18:36] aklt: ryah: The crypto stuff seems somewhat broken, would be grat to have it debugged or somehow made sane!
[18:36] micheil: ryah: you'll possibly love what I've just discussed with isaac
[18:36] tjholowaychuk: it wont be less broken as a module
[18:36] tjholowaychuk: and if anyone wants a decent implementation we will force people to compile more stuff
[18:37] tjholowaychuk: which is kinda lame
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[18:37] ryah: aklt: debugging your issue is what made me decide to take it out
[18:37] micheil: ryah: how about you do: tls from crypto into a new node core module
[18:37] micheil: and then remove crypto?
[18:37] micheil: if that makes sense.
[18:37] micheil: so, process.binding('tls')
[18:38] aklt: ryah: Cool!  I also gave it a couple of hours, but I ended up producing other problems,...  I am no openssl expert to say the least...
[18:38] ryah: im removing it because the code is horrible
[18:38] ryah: and it's not related to networking
[18:38] ryah: and i dont need it
[18:38] micheil: +1 to removing it.
[18:38] micheil: but also +1 to having someone maintain it.
[18:39] aklt: +1 for that!
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[18:39] tjholowaychuk: +1 bASLDFASDf
[18:39] Kingdutch: +2 for some kind of working ssl though
[18:40] micheil: Kingdutch: you obviously haven't really been following node@head
[18:40] aklt: Probably something decent could be made if one keeps half an eye on an existing openssl binding, python, Lua, or whatever
[18:40] Kingdutch: micheil: I havent
[18:40] micheil: well, it has some very good / awesome leaps closer towards working ssl
[18:40] Kingdutch: Oh ok
[18:40] Kingdutch: :D
[18:41] isaacs: ryah: aww, it's super handy having hashing in node.
[18:41] devdazed: tjholowaychuk: to get around the issue of the async tests not running properly, i have the following solution
[18:41] isaacs: ryah: but i get it, you're on the warpath ;)
[18:41] devdazed: tjholowaychuk: have 1 test per file 
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[18:41] devdazed: tjholowaychuk: then i wrote this wrapper: https://gist.github.com/797182
[18:42] aklt: I would also *love* to have hashing as I need it to decrypt cookies in an application I am writing
[18:42] tjholowaychuk: devdazed: i dont know what libraries you are using, i've never needed it
[18:42] tjholowaychuk: for mongodb, redis, etc
[18:42] mscdex: well, base64 is related to HTTP
[18:42] devdazed: so just run node expresso_suite_runner.js and it will run all tests asynchronously and report back when it is done
[18:42] mscdex: for auth
[18:42] mscdex: :p
[18:42] tjholowaychuk: most of them queue commands until connected
[18:42] aklt: ...But maybe this is a good path towards a better implementation?
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[18:43] devdazed: right but when i have 2 tests, one inside a mongodb connection and one in a redis connectio, the first gets run but the second doesnt
[18:43] matti: Hey guys.
[18:43] tjholowaychuk: devdazed: yeah but im saying I dont use async exports at all
[18:43] devdazed: theres also an issue where it give the wrong test name if the one passes and the other doesnt
[18:44] devdazed: oh, i know i was putting it out here in case anyone could use it
[18:44] matti: I have a problem with when I use sys.pump in 0.2.6 -- node seem to not close the read stream ... I was trying few things I was able to find in Google.
[18:44] matti: But it still keeps it open.
[18:44] aklt: ryah: What came out of your debugging? Did you conclude that it is not worth keeping the code for a possible module?
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[18:44] mscdex: today is epoch day 15000!
[18:44] mscdex: :-D
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[18:44] matti: Any clue? Advice? Idea? 42? ;]
[18:44] matti: mscdex: ;p
[18:45] mscdex: hope you all have planned your parties
[18:45] matti: I am stumbled by this...
[18:45] aklt: Yay!
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[18:49] matti: Meh.
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[18:51] isaacs: mscdex: the party is in 13 days
[18:51] mscdex: parties are tonight!
[18:51] mscdex: throught midnight gmt!
[18:51] mscdex: :-D
[18:51] mscdex: s/throught/through
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[18:53] aklt: Anyone here severely qualified for doing a binding to openssl functions?  
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[18:54] Aikar: aklt: well it wouldnt neccessarily be a qualification of 'openssl', more so any binding lol
[18:55] aklt: Aikar: No maybe not. I was assuming that if one has dealt with openssl before it would be easier to do it right. 
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[18:56] Aikar: well a lib exposes a function, binding it to node simply requires C/C++ knowledge on importing a shared lib, writing a wrapper function thats exported to node, and pass args correctly.
[18:57] aklt: Yea.  I would attempt it, or at least a module that covers my needs, but it would be great to have some advice on openssl.
[18:58] aklt: I say that because I think correct use of openssl was the most difficult part 
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[18:59] konobi: aklt: what are you trying to do?
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[19:00] aklt: konobi: Something like this, at least: http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs-dev/browse_thread/thread/436e5d81e5f4dba3
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[19:01] aklt: ...but other hashes/digests would also be nice to have,... if node_crypto.cc is going to go away.
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[19:01] mnbvasd: mscdex: seems pretty arbitary, 12345678901 was more exciting ;)
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[19:02] mnbvasd: 
ACTION throws http://js.5sh.net/childmodule/ at the world.

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[19:05] tiemonster: 
ACTION ducks

[19:05] devdazed: hi all, is it possible to check if a port is available?
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[19:06] tiemonster: probably :-)
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[19:06] tiemonster: you mean from within Node?
[19:06] tiemonster: or in general?
[19:06] devdazed: let me rephrase: if it is possible, how do you chekc if a port is available from node?
[19:07] mnbvasd: devdazed: netstat lna | grep :<portno> , or just try to bind to it and see if it fails.
[19:07] tiemonster: I can think of lots of reasons why you shouldn't even try to check from Node
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[19:07] tiemonster: and a couple why you might want to
[19:07] mnbvasd: erm add a - to that.
[19:08] devdazed: well, during the tests im running multiple instances of expresso to run my tests faster. but expresso bind to port 5555 for the http server part
[19:08] devdazed: so i want to modify expresso to check the port first then bind if it is available otherwise use a different port
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[19:10] tiemonster: or you could check in a shell script and pass the port to Node
[19:10] sstephenson: if you listen on port 0, the OS will choose a random port for you
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[19:10] sstephenson: server.listen(0, function() { console.log(server.address().port) })
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[19:12] devdazed: sstephenson: im getting EADDRINUSE, Address already in use
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[19:12] sstephenson: if server is an Express/Connect server it won't work, unfortunately :/
[19:12] sstephenson: Connect overrides listen() and does an || to default port to 3000
[19:12] sstephenson: instead of checking if port is 0 vs undefined
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[19:13] devdazed: ah, i see
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[19:13] tjholowaychuk: sstephenson: express only proxies to do some setup stuff
[19:13] tjholowaychuk: but yeah connect has no reason to anymore
[19:14] tjholowaychuk: i can change that right now :)
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[19:14] sstephenson: tjholowaychuk: that'd be sweet. ran into it the other day with some tests
[19:14] devdazed: sweeeeet, makin progress
[19:14] tjholowaychuk: sstephenson: i dont think the default to 3000 works right now anyway haha
[19:15] cronopio: jajajajjaja
[19:15] cronopio: sorry wrong chan :(
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[19:18] tiemonster: Has anyone thought of using Node as a remote administration tool?
[19:18] tiemonster: Allow people to run a subset of safe commands without bothering with ssh?
[19:18] devdazed: like cap shell for ruby?
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[19:19] tiemonster: 
ACTION googles cap shell

[19:20] tiemonster: devdazed: exactly, except in the browser
[19:20] devdazed: ooohhh
[19:20] tiemonster: yeah
[19:20] devdazed: i thought of making a command line version
[19:20] mnbvasd: what't the cap shell?
[19:21] tiemonster: http://weblog.jamisbuck.org/2006/9/21/introducing-the-capistrano-shell
[19:21] devdazed: lets you execute ssh command on multiple servers simultaneously and puts the response
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[19:21] tiemonster: I should mess with that when I have some downtime. I manage three servers at the moment, and that would be a big plus.
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[19:23] mnbvasd: tiemonster: you mean like rpc stuff, such as dnode?
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[19:45] Kingdutch: Is fs.realpathSync() supposed to throw an error when the file doesn't exist?
[19:45] Kingdutch: And what's the best practice to check if a file exists?
[19:46] kristsk: i am doing fs.stat and catching
[19:46] Kingdutch: Hmm
[19:47] Kingdutch: I'm just catching realpathSync then
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[19:47] kristsk: well, if disk will get bogged down, that will stall node process...
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[19:47] kristsk: otoh if you do that on startup only it prbably will not matter much
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[19:48] Kingdutch: Meh it's just a little node.js app for serving up from a directory cause I'm too lazy to install apache
[19:48] Kingdutch: And it's all HTML/JS
[19:48] kristsk: oh..
[19:48] Kingdutch: sudo node main.js /servefromthisdir
[19:48] Kingdutch: Doing a realpathcheck to sandbox it
[19:49] Kingdutch: So a .. would get resolved but wouldn't start with arg[2] anymore and thus fail
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[20:00] cloudhead: micheil: yo
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[20:08] tim_smart: saschagehlich: node-id3 supports id3v2
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[20:08] saschagehlich: but only reading, right?
[20:09] piscisaureus: ryah: champagne. caviar. cigars
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[20:10] ryah: piscisaureus: marc's reply? :)
[20:10] piscisaureus: yeah. it's a new era
[20:10] ryah: see, he can be reasoned with!
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[20:11] piscisaureus: I'm pleasantly surprised. Now lets see what he comes up with
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[20:25] piscisaureus: ryah: does node hook ev_syserr?
[20:26] ryah: piscisaureus: no
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[20:26] piscisaureus: did I say something rude that made him mad?
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[20:31] bradleymeck: piscisaureus, who now?
[20:32] piscisaureus: bradleymeck: never mind
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[20:33] sveimac: Anyone used nvm? Im getting "error: could not configure a cxx compiler!" when i try to install any node version with nvm
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[20:34] techwraith: Anyone here have experience with connect middleware?
[20:35] tjholowaychuk: techwraith: whats up
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[20:35] techwraith: Working on a proxy middleware, I need to be able to pass options into it, but I still need access to the req and res
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[20:35] techwraith: Do I do that with a returned function?
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[20:36] tjholowaychuk: module.exports = function(options){ return function(){}; }
[20:36] tjholowaychuk: the inner function is the middleware
[20:36] tjholowaychuk: outter is setup
[20:36] techwraith: module.exports = function(options){ return function(req,res){});
[20:36] techwraith: got it
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[20:37] techwraith: what else gets passed into the inner function?
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[20:37] tjholowaychuk: req, res, next
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[20:37] techwraith: perfect, thanks!
[20:37] tjholowaychuk: you can either next() or next(err)
[20:38] techwraith: As always TJ, you're awesome :)
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[20:41] techwraith: Also, how do I require other stuff to use in the middleware? If I require it before creating the server will I have access to it inside the middleware?
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[20:42] JimBastard: can anyone explain to me why jQuery.each's callback is function(iterator, value) and javascript's forEach callback is function(value, iterator) ?
[20:42] herbySk: techwraith: if it's not some serious issue, require it inside, it's cached, anyway; it will be loaded only once
[20:43] tjholowaychuk: require() was (is still?) slow
[20:43] tjholowaychuk: doing the stats or whatever
[20:43] tjholowaychuk: not sure if that was fixed for cached modules
[20:43] herbySk: JimBastard: javascript's is value, index, container
[20:43] tjholowaychuk: IMO do your best not to lazy require
[20:43] chapel: JimBastard: cause jquery loves to be unique?
[20:43] Aikar: tjholowaychuk: pretty sure its not fixed yet
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[20:43] Aikar: ive been messing in there alot lately
[20:43] JimBastard: herbySk: yeah, i didnt include the 3rd arg for my example. ,but its still the same question
[20:44] tjholowaychuk: Aikar: ah :)
[20:44] Aikar: did someone say they were going to work on that specifically? i know they were talking about making the cache be based on current state of paths, i could implement the fix rather easily
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[20:45] bradleymeck: jimbastard forEach doesnt appear in jquery core?
[20:45] Aikar: bradleymeck: i think hes asking why did jquery do it backwards
[20:45] herbySk: Aikar: it seems module system is to be refactored in the near future, so this will be included, but I think it won't be done for existing system any soon
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[20:46] herbySk: 
ACTION wonders if sechrist has a virus...

[20:46] Aikar: ill look into adding it tonight
[20:46] Aikar: ryah: you here?
[20:47] bradleymeck: lazy requires are nice if you need a system up as fast as possible, but when you have a server you dont want it to randomly go an grab disk when you think it should have something loaded
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[20:47] bradleymeck: jimbastard, only reason i can think is it is closer to a normal for(;;) loop which is done by index?
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[20:49] eazyigz: what is the best memcache client for node?
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[20:50] Aikar: i can have modules fully cache and not hit disk done within 30m tonight to current system. i just wanna see if i can talk to ryah about my pull request i made last night before blowing away that code.
[20:50] bradleymeck: eazyigz, is there ever a point you don't have something in memory?
[20:50] JimBastard: bradleymeck: the jquery guys just say its an inconstancy they cant really fix now 
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[20:51] bradleymeck: 
ACTION wonders if express supports template cacheing

[20:51] eazyigz: bradleymeck: its just for development purposes for now.  Eventually I will implement rabbitjs
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[20:52] tjholowaychuk: bradleymeck: yeah
[20:52] tjholowaychuk: caching of the compiled function
[20:52] tjholowaychuk: not renders
[20:52] tjholowaychuk: (thinking you meant functions)
[20:53] bradleymeck: yea functions, caching renders would be too complex to detect
[20:53] tjholowaychuk: yup
[20:53] tjholowaychuk: lol
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[20:53] tjholowaychuk: NODE_ENV=production will enable caching, also { cache: true } I believe
[20:53] eazyigz: when declaring variables in nodejs, is it important to use 'var'?  I mean since there is no DOM, then there is no risk of polluting the global window object...
[20:53] tjholowaychuk: eazyigz: yes
[20:53] tjholowaychuk: you dont want that
[20:53] tjholowaychuk: lol
[20:53] tjholowaychuk: and lookups would be much slower
[20:53] eazyigz: you mean lookups without var are slower?
[20:54] tjholowaychuk: yeah, amongst other bugs
[20:54] eazyigz: ok, gotcha
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[20:55] brianc: eazyigz: when declaring variables in <language> is it important not to use global variables? I mean since there is no DOM then there is no risk of polluting the global window object either.  You still polute the global space.
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[20:55] eazyigz: for some reason coffeescript decided to omit var when it compiled to js
[20:56] brianc: eazyigz: yikes.  maybe it put the 'var _a' a few lines above the variable being assigned 
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[20:56] brianc: i think i saw some compiled coffee-script and it was declaring all the variables at the top of the function 
[20:57] eazyigz: you're right
[20:57] eazyigz: i missed that
[20:57] eazyigz: sorry
[20:57] brianc: eazyigz: no worries what so ever 
[20:57] bradleymeck: eazyigz also variables in global scope may have cross stack colission as well as the fact they will never be GC'd
[20:57] eazyigz: i gotta read up on how v8 does GC
[20:58] bradleymeck: well the global is never gc'ed so you cant gc its properties ;)
[20:58] eazyigz: can't i manually gc?  I mean like in C/C++?
[20:58] bradleymeck: you can use delete
[20:58] brianc: maybe "delete"
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[20:58] Gregor: 
ACTION bashes all three of you in the head.

[20:58] bradleymeck: awww gregor
[20:58] brianc: yeah, you don't wanna use 'delete'
[20:59] Gregor: "Manually GC" is meaningless, you cannot manually allocate/deallocate, and delete in JavaScript is not the same as delete in C++.
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[20:59] fission6: how come when i do npm link in my package i get the version symlink of like: 9999.0.0-LINK-a4755c50
[20:59] bradleymeck: never said it was the same
[20:59] eazyigz: Gregor: but v8 is c++ based, not JS based
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[21:00] brianc: Gregor: var garbage = { collect: function() { console.log('manual collection!') } }; garbage.collect();
[21:00] brianc: har har har
[21:00] brianc: okay back to work <3
[21:00] Gregor: 
ACTION goes into the fetal position and cries :P

[21:01] Aikar: lol
[21:01] eazyigz: very funny :)
[21:01] fission6: no ideas? this seems to be common, 9999.0.0-LINK-a4755c50
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[21:01] Aikar: fission6: ask isaacs 
[21:02] micheil: fission6: it ensures that the linked version is the one always used by require()
[21:02] micheil: iirc.
[21:02] Aikar: how do you stop a pull request on github
[21:02] fission6: yes thats fine
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[21:02] fission6: i just dont see why i am getting a v number of .99999
[21:02] fission6: Aikar: sorry what
[21:03] Aikar: i want to retract my pull request on github
[21:03] bradleymeck: eazyigz, lets just say you can never be assured that you are going to deallocate something soon, even with the C++ api (without some major hacking)
[21:03] Aikar: i closed it on ry's side but its still showing in my pull request
[21:03] Aikar: i guess just revert my commits and force push?
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[21:04] darklajid: I asked that before and cannot find the (good) answer in my logs so far.. express question: I want to split the app into multiple files (i.e. keep everything related per file, < 100 lines/file). Recommendations how to do that?
[21:04] fission6: this is odd
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[21:05] Aikar: darklajid: remove your enter key and use lots of semicolons? /sarcasm :P
[21:05] sechrist has joined the channel
[21:05] darklajid: Right :)
[21:05] eazyigz:  I put a folder called node-memcached in the same directory as my js file.  Then in my js file I do "memcached = require('./node-memcached');", but I get an error: Cannot find module './node-memcached' 
[21:05] eazyigz: it must be something silly i missed?
[21:05] Aikar: eazyigz: need an index.js in that directory
[21:06] lightharut: I need some help for mongodb native driver for node.js
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[21:06] eazyigz: Aikar: is this a new requirement for nodejs or has it always been like that?
[21:06] bradleymeck: always, index.js in folder or a .js file otherwise
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[21:07] eazyigz: bradleymeck: you mean index.js in node-memcached folder?  Or in its parent folder?
[21:07] bradleymeck: in any folder you require
[21:08] halfhalo: hmmm... node does not wan to talk to eucalyptus.... sadface
[21:08] eazyigz: what the heck?  Why can't an index.js be in there automatically, I mean if these packages have that requirement....
[21:08] fission6: okay one last time, any reason why npm is installing my package as some_module -> ./some_module@9999.0.0-LINK-a4755c50
[21:09] bradleymeck: eazyigz talk to the maintainer
[21:09] isaacs: fission6: because you've linked it?
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[21:09] fission6: yeah but i was expecting it to have th @v number specified in my package.json
[21:09] fission6: isaacs: 
[21:09] isaacs: fission6: and the 9999.0.0-LINK-a4755c50 version (linked version) is active
[21:09] isaacs: fission6: link packages get a fakey version.
[21:09] tim_smart: isaacs: Fun little tool that uses npm https://github.com/Tim-Smart/npm-deploy
[21:09] V1: eazyigz: as for a stable memcached client, I suggest https://github.com/3rd-Eden/node-memcached :)
[21:09] isaacs: fission6: otherwise it breaks in Bad Ways when you touch the package.json file
[21:10] fission6: damn how do i change that because i have a dependancy on that package
[21:10] isaacs: though i think i could maybe yank out that stuff and it might work now
[21:10] eazyigz: bradeymeck: I looked at redis-node-client package and it also doesn't have index.js.  Are people unaware of this requirement?  I know I wasn't.
[21:10] isaacs: fission6: change what?
[21:10] eazyigz: bradleymeck:... sorry
[21:10] isaacs: fission6: how do you make npm not do that with link packages, or how do you not use a link package?
[21:10] Aikar: eazyigz: what package?
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[21:10] bradleymeck: eazyigz, most use the main field in package.json and just use npm
[21:10] Aikar: if you tell it require('dir/') it has to load some file
[21:10] fission6: how do i specify "some_package" as a dependancy for another package if its version is "fakey"
[21:10] V1: Packages don't need an index.js if they link to the correct package name 
[21:11] eazyigz: Aikar: https://github.com/fictorial/redis-node-client
[21:11] Aikar: eazyigz: yeah that author didnt make it 'non npm' friendly
[21:11] isaacs: fission6: {"dependencies":{"some_package":"*"}} would match it
[21:11] tim_smart: eazyigz: You don't need a index.js
[21:11] V1: eazyigz: Read the description, it's deprecated
[21:11] Aikar: actually he did, he just expects you to reference to the lib folder
[21:11] isaacs: fission6: you could also do "1.2.3 || 9999"
[21:11] tim_smart: It just makes it easier for deployment
[21:11] eazyigz: ahhh...
[21:11] fission6: i think i have it now, nice thanks!
[21:12] isaacs: eazyigz: why not use `npm install redis`?
[21:12] eazyigz: V1: node-memcached from 3rd-Eden doesn't have index.js either
[21:12] isaacs: eazyigz: https://github.com/mranney/node_redis#readme
[21:12] V1: eazyigz: it has main: "main": "./nMemcached",
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[21:13] eazyigz: V1: so you're right, index.js is not an absolute requirement
[21:13] eazyigz: who just said it was?
[21:13] eazyigz: :)
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[21:13] V1: :p
[21:13] Aikar: eazyigz: i said it is for you to do require('directory/');
[21:13] isaacs: also, index.js is kinda weird in the debugger and stack traces.  you end up with a lot of index.js files.
[21:13] isaacs: it'd be cooler if it loaded foo/foo.js when you do require("foo")
[21:13] Aikar: if you require straight to that github repo, it doesnt have an index so node doesnt know what to load
[21:14] Aikar: isaacs: ill add support for that if ryans cool with it
[21:14] isaacs: Aikar: sure, should be pretty trivial, though it will increase the number of stats, which is unfortuante.
[21:14] isaacs: but then we could deprecate index.js
[21:14] isaacs: (maybe, eventually, some day)
[21:14] Aikar: isaacs: well i plan to fix the stat thing tonight/now
[21:14] bradleymeck: lol require("git@github.com:...") would be terrible
[21:15] isaacs: Aikar: how?  felixge already made it pretty optimal
[21:15] isaacs: bradleymeck++
[21:15] v8bot:  isaacs has given a beer to bradleymeck. bradleymeck now has 1 beers.
[21:15] tim_smart: bradleymeck: I'm playing with a deploy tool the reads a deploy.js file in your project https://github.com/Tim-Smart/npm-deploy/blob/master/test/mixture/deploy.js
[21:15] Aikar: what change he make? ive been messing in modules and i didnt see any cache stuff
[21:16] tim_smart: bradleymeck: It then also reads the package.json and installs listed dependencies there.
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[21:16] bradleymeck: ah github deploy hooks, i vaguely remember making one
[21:16] isaacs: Aikar: check out the code in lib/module.js, starting around like 84
[21:16] isaacs: *line 84
[21:16] Aikar: oh nvm
[21:16] sechrist has joined the channel
[21:16] Aikar: it is there
[21:17] isaacs: Aikar: it's cached based on the request and the state of require.paths
[21:17] Aikar: although it needs a reference to parent
[21:17] isaacs: the "request" thing is already glommed onto the parent's path
[21:17] isaacs: if it's relativ
[21:17] isaacs: e
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[21:18] Aikar: i was going to implement it right at the top of Module._load with almost same thing but cacheKey = json.stringify({filename,parent.id,paths}) or so
[21:19] isaacs: Aikar: unnecessary
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[21:19] isaacs: check out the _resolveLookupPaths function
[21:19] isaacs: your suggestion ^^ will result in require("foo") being different based on different parents
[21:19] isaacs: but if bar.js does require("foo"), and baz.js does require("foo"), and require.paths hasn't changed, then it shoudl hit the cache
[21:20] Aikar: hmm true
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[21:20] Aikar: i guess its good then :)
[21:21] isaacs: Aikar: yeah, what's there is good
[21:21] isaacs: at least, in terms of caches and whatnot.
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[21:21] Aikar: i just didnt know it had been done already 
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[21:22] cloudhea: are there any plans to have the http/net clients handle disconnects/reconnects gracefully?
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[21:23] Aikar: cloudhea: thats a userland problem
[21:23] Guest31915: v8: 'who is awesome?' ? 'you are awesome' : ''
[21:23] v8bot: Guest31915: "you are awesome"
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[21:23] Aikar: people would want to handle those situations differently
[21:24] Aikar: well at least for net
[21:24] Aikar: i dont know if http client even supports keep alives, so what 'reconnect' would there be?
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[21:27] cloudhea: Aikar: yea I'm kind of torn between whether or not it's userland
[21:27] cloudhea: Aikar: what I mean is say the server goes down for a couple of seconds
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[21:28] cloudhea: if you don't handle it correctly, you'll lose data, and your client won't reconnect to it when it goes back up
[21:28] cloudhea: or you'll juse get an exception, cause the socket won't accept writes
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[21:30] isaacs: ryah: ping
[21:31] isaacs: ryah: this long-stack-trace thing that tom did...
[21:31] isaacs: ryah: can we get a hook the he can use to wrap all the fs.dostuff(a, b, c, d, e, f, cb) type functions?
[21:31] tjholowaychuk: isaacs: where is this?
[21:31] isaacs: tjholowaychuk: npm install long-stack-traces
[21:31] isaacs: tjholowaychuk: then do require("long-stack-traces") in your code.
[21:32] isaacs: and you'll get stack traces that are long.
[21:32] isaacs: it's pretty winful
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[21:32] cloudhea: +1
[21:32] tjholowaychuk: woah why so much code for that
[21:32] Qbix1: hey
[21:33] Qbix1: isaacs are you the guy who made the facebook-graph-client?
[21:33] isaacs: tjholowaychuk: so much code?
[21:33] isaacs: Qbix1: nope
[21:33] Qbix1: oh :(
[21:33] Qbix1: does anyone here know
[21:33] Qbix1: by any chance what access_token I use to post on someone's facebook wall?
[21:33] Qbix1: is it the access token of the user themselves?
[21:34] isaacs: Qbix1: `npm owner ls facebook-graph-client` says miksago did it.  He's micheil here on irc
[21:34] tjholowaychuk: isaacs: Error.stackTraceLimit = Infinity
[21:34] micheil: yeah
[21:34] micheil: hi.
[21:34] micheil: I'm the developer.
[21:34] Qbix1: thanks
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[21:34] Qbix1: micheil there you are :)
[21:34] micheil: it's a votizen.com project.
[21:34] Qbix1: I am wondering how to post on 1000 users' walls for my broadcasting project
[21:34] Qbix1: (EGreg and I are the same person)
[21:34] isaacs: tjholowaychuk: does that do that, too?  don't you have to wrap something to save the stack when you jump into the event loop?
[21:34] Qbix1: who do I post as? Can I post as this user on their own wall, by storing their access_token and using it later?
[21:35] Qbix1: Since every user has a limit of 15 posts on walls a day
[21:35] micheil: you would need those 1000 users' access_tokens and you would need to fire them in a loop.
[21:35] isaacs: tjholowaychuk: it's not just about setting the limit longer, it's about having the -------- and then the calling scope
[21:35] Qbix1: I am just worried that their access_tokens expire when they log out
[21:35] micheil: access_tokens expire.
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[21:35] micheil: that's what offline_access is for
[21:35] tjholowaychuk: isaacs: ill have to give that thing a try
[21:35] Qbix1: but if I have publish_stream permissions, that includes offline_access permission
[21:35] sechrist has joined the channel
[21:35] Qbix1: and so, with offline_access (and publish_stream), the access token DOESN'T expire when they log out?
[21:36] micheil: yes
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[21:37] micheil: or at least, that is my understanding
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[21:39] tim_smart: access_tokens expire when the user says "Don't let this application access my info"
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[21:41] micheil: yeah
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[21:42] micheil: Qbix1: for what it's worth, tim_smart can also help with that module :)
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[21:45] tjholowaychuk: isaacs: oh gross it wraps everything?
[21:45] tjholowaychuk: brutal
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[21:45] tjholowaychuk: lol
[21:45] isaacs: tjholowaychuk: well, yeah, it's not supposed to be used when speed really matters :)
[21:45] sechrist has joined the channel
[21:45] isaacs: it'd be nice if there was an "unhook" mechanism
[21:45] tjholowaychuk: proof of concept i suppose
[21:46] fission6: why does index.coffee go on the outside of a module
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[21:48] isaacs: fission6: "on the outside of a module"?
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[21:48] fission6: should it go on th einsde of a modules folder
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[21:55] bradleymeck: anyone have a sms gateway module?
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[21:55] piscisaureus: pquerna: is the prio list working out?
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[21:57] refractalize: hi, having some trouble installing npm. ran the curl ../instal.sh | sh, got "It worked" but no idea where the npm binary is... anybody got any ideas?
[21:57] isaacs: refractalize: where's node?
[21:57] isaacs: refractalize: that is, what does `which node` say?
[21:58] refractalize: isaacs: /opt/local/bin
[21:58] refractalize: macports
[21:58] pquerna: piscisaureus: yeah... i'll send you our basic list of goals today, in a little bit, got a few things pulling me right this minute
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[21:59] piscisaureus: pquerna: good to hear. I won't be here much during nighttime this week, but I'll be working anyway
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[22:00] refractalize: isaacs: ok, removed macports, using make'd node. thanks for the hint
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[22:05] tanepiper: http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2011/01/26/internet-run-ip-addresses-happens-anyones-guess/   fox news fail
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[22:19] bingomanatee: 
ACTION is working again

[22:20] bingomanatee: Anyone here do couchdb consulting?
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[22:30] Friki: hi
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[22:31] defeated: I'm fairly new to node/commonjs, I'm wondering is there any way to get at functionality that isn't explicitly exported from a module, or is it basically considered not for public consumption?
[22:31] nooder: bingomanatee, just ask
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[22:31] Friki: I cannot install node.js on cygwin and I am receiving error: Build failed: -> task failed (err #2) 
[22:32] defeated: specifically I want to use some of the View functionality from express.js without having to go through the whole render process to do so
[22:32] Friki: it happens for versions higher than 0.3.x
[22:32] nooder: Friki, try built versions http://node-js.prcn.co.cc/
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[22:32] defeated: but it doesn't seem to be exposed anyway that I can figure to get at ;)
[22:33] Friki: wow - i will try it 
[22:33] Friki: asap
[22:33] bingomanatee: I just got a client on the hook for a noSql transform of real estate listings; the nature of his dataset - the need for instrospection into the history of a record - suggest to me CouchDB over MongoDB, my current standard noSql solution. 
[22:33] bingomanatee: Two things I want to know about couchDB - 
[22:33] maushu: It's evil.
[22:33] bingomanatee: 1) how is sharding/partitioning handled
[22:33] maushu: Worship mongodb till the end of days.
[22:34] chapel: lol
[22:34] chapel: bingomanatee: couchdb doesn't do sharding
[22:34] chapel: master <-> master
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[22:34] maushu: When I look at this http://couchdb.apache.org/img/sketch.png it makes me twitch.
[22:35] bingomanatee: m. thtas a problem. I'm looking into couchdb-lounge a superset product to see if it meets my needs. 
[22:35] chapel: there is bigcouch which gives a more distributed approach
[22:35] bingomanatee: yeah that is a problem. 
[22:35] tilgovi: problem?
[22:35] chapel: why does it make you twitch?
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[22:35] bingomanatee: I'm really not eager to become an erlang programmer - I am hopign that stuff stays under the hood where it belongs. 
[22:35] chapel: uhh
[22:35] chapel: you can use erland
[22:35] tilgovi: bingomanatee: I can tell you that while I'm committed to improving lounge for another iteration or so, my long term strategy is to move to bigcouch.
[22:35] chapel: erlang, but everything can be done with js
[22:36] tilgovi: And I'm the only developer actively contributing to couchdb-lounge.
[22:36] bingomanatee: I'm probably going to dual test couch against mongo for this particular client to see which product meets their needs the best
[22:36] chapel: mapreduce/views/designs
[22:36] bingomanatee: Since I already rock with Mongo 
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[22:36] bingomanatee: what are the discriminatory features between bigcouch and lounge?
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[22:36] chapel: well bingomanatee couchdb is great for dealing with a lot of data
[22:36] bingomanatee: The client is in the realty space and wants to metacrawl the real estate listings. 
[22:37] chapel: honestly I would choose couchdb for something like realty
[22:37] bingomanatee: So we can be guaranteed that the datbase will never be bigger than the number of houses in the planet
[22:37] tilgovi: bingomanatee: lounge has asynchronous replication whereas bigcouch lets you specify the consistency level. bigcouch is probably more efficient since it operates at the erlang layer and avoids more JSON round trip encodings
[22:37] bingomanatee: times the number of times said houses are sold. 
[22:37] chapel: because it would be super simple to make nice mapreduce views to handle all types of data, and it incrementally updates
[22:37] tilgovi: from a client perspective they're both just couches
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[22:38] chapel: I dont know enough about mongo to really speak, but I was under the impression it doesn't actually store mapreduce results and runs them each time?
[22:38] bingomanatee: So the sharding is subsumed by bigcouch/lounge?
[22:38] bingomanatee: hey youre the same guy... :D
[22:39] tilgovi: if by subsumed you mean hidden from the application, yeah.
[22:39] bingomanatee: thats ideal. 
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[22:39] bingomanatee: so maushu - what is your issue with couch?
[22:39] tilgovi: yeah. bigcouch and lounge are actually very similar from the outside and I talk constantly with the cloudant people so I can move to make that even *more* true.
[22:39] bingomanatee: I'd like to hear both sides of the story. 
[22:39] techwraith: Does anyone have any ideas for how to implement an accurate file upload progress bar with js on the front end and node on the back?
[22:40] maushu: bingomanatee, erlang.
[22:40] tilgovi: like I said... I'm trying to move lounge toward bigcouch until they converge enough that I can flip my production cluster over as much as possible "in place"
[22:40] maushu: Everyone knows erlang was created using the blood of sacrificed virgins to the dark gods at moonlight.
[22:40] bingomanatee: maushu - yes - but is it exposed? or are you concernd about performance?
[22:41] bingomanatee: yeah - can't really take that to my client. 
[22:41] bingomanatee: Give me the power point version if you can. 
[22:41] tilgovi: maushu: but that keeps the children away. it's like having a spooky sign outside your mansion production studio so you don't get interrupted while churning out chart-topping beats.
[22:41] maushu: ...
[22:41] maushu: CONSPIRANCY!
[22:42] maushu: bingomanatee, just see that image. Apache usually focus on proper development instead of performance.
[22:42] bingomanatee: I'm seeing massive job security. If I can hook my clients on an erlang based product I can jerk up my rates big time and they'll have to pay :D
[22:42] maushu: Then do it.
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[22:42] bingomanatee: I dunno. I do plan to run the couch system head to head with MongoDB to see what the experiential difference is. 
[22:42] chapel: but you see, you dont touch erland
[22:42] chapel: erlang
[22:43] chapel: its json/js as far as interfacing with it
[22:43] maushu: The reason I don't use it, it's because of erlang, the need to run a erlang vm just to run couch.
[22:43] bingomanatee: thats what I'm thinking. I mean, what is MongoDB written in, C? who cares really?
[22:43] tilgovi: bingomanatee: ooh, yay. everyone loves comparing apples to oranges ;)
[22:43] maushu: And sharding, I need sharding.
[22:43] bingomanatee: They are both round fruit and about the same size and weight. 
[22:43] bingomanatee: ha.
[22:43] tilgovi: about the same until you bite into them.
[22:43] tilgovi: it's a pretty good analogy really
[22:43] bingomanatee: Yeah. 
[22:43] chapel: mongodb is like mysql of nosql
[22:43] bingomanatee: They both keep you alive. 
[22:43] bingomanatee: Oranges cure scurvy. 
[22:44] chapel: couchdb is something different
[22:44] bingomanatee: Apples are good for your theeth. 
[22:44] maushu: sql server?
[22:44] bradleymeck: sharding is the secret sause
[22:44] bingomanatee: Reall - since when was comparing an orange to an apple a formidable deliverable. 
[22:44] maushu: bingomanatee, and then there is the banana: redis.
[22:44] bingomanatee: Now - comprare an orange to a buick - thats a challenge. 
[22:44] maushu: Very tasty but can stab you in the eye.
[22:45] bingomanatee: so can your own thumb. 
[22:45] bingomanatee: gonna cut that off for safety?
[22:45] tilgovi: maushu: how can you get stabbed in the eye with a buick?
[22:45] bingomanatee: You got two eyes 
[22:45] bingomanatee: hes talking about the banana
[22:45] maushu: I meant the banana.
[22:46] maushu: I wonder how you didn't care about "tasty".
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[22:47] bingomanatee: okay so my take away is this - both Mongo and Couch have partitioning solutions. Mongo might be a little faster with itst straight binary feed, but Couch has built-in archives. 
[22:47] bingomanatee: Is that a fair summary?
[22:47] flukes1: test-tls-securepair-client test fails on latest git - is this a known / platform specific thing?
[22:47] tilgovi: bingomanatee: no built in archives. false.
[22:47] tilgovi: MVCC != history.
[22:47] chapel: bingomanatee: you can build a simple archive system though
[22:48] maushu: bingomanatee, archives?
[22:48] tilgovi: you can build it, but it's not provided.
[22:48] chapel: yeah
[22:48] bingomanatee: Okay so that is not a discriminatory feature.
[22:48] chapel: people assume _rev = archives
[22:48] chapel: but those are purged on a compaction
[22:48] maushu: You mean versioning?
[22:48] bingomanatee: okay - so the archive system in couch is a temporary conceit. 
[22:48] bingomanatee: yeah. 
[22:48] maushu: Like mongodb has for gridfs?
[22:48] bingomanatee: So in both cases I have to implement versioning by hand.
[22:48] chapel: but bingomanatee its really easy to just store past revisions as an attachment
[22:49] bingomanatee: I figured. 
[22:49] chapel: http://blog.couchone.com/post/632718824/simple-document-versioning-with-couchdb << bingomanatee
[22:49] bingomanatee: Obviously versioning is not the biggest obstacle here. 
[22:49] tilgovi: mongo *is* a lot faster if your dataset fits in RAM (some of this is illusory and a difference in the sync/flush and write guarantees). Once you overflow RAM I imagine they're quite similar.
[22:49] maushu: Have you seen this? http://www.mongodb.org/display/DOCS/Comparing+Mongo+DB+and+Couch+DB
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[22:50] chapel: well I prefer couchdb's way of doing mapreduce
[22:50] tilgovi: chapel: I prefer writing erlang to writing C++ and I'm hot for internals, not use cases, so I'm gonna duck out of this discussion.
[22:51] bingomanatee: Okay - how about text searches? can you search for text inside a field in couch?
[22:51] maushu: bingomanatee, for versioning in mongodb just create a multiple key with id and date/version and then limit(1) while searching for the id and order by date/version.
[22:51] tilgovi: bingomanatee: couchdb-lucene
[22:51] bingomanatee: sweet. 
[22:51] maushu: Or solr?
[22:51] bingomanatee: see thats a win. 
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[22:51] bingomanatee: yeah I figured I'd eventually have to roll in solr. 
[22:51] tilgovi: the developer, rnewson, just went to cloudant so I would look for more polished search products in the future there.
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[22:52] bingomanatee: the couchdb-lucene developer?
[22:52] tilgovi: yeah
[22:52] bingomanatee: well - is it stable?
[22:52] bingomanatee: Because you have squat in that area for Mongo - its pretty much DIY. 
[22:52] chapel: yeah its stable as far as I know
[22:52] bingomanatee: maushu - yes
[22:52] chapel: check out cloudants implementation
[22:53] bingomanatee: Interesting. 
[22:53] bingomanatee: How thorough/accurate do you guys find nosql.com?
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[22:54] tilgovi: 
ACTION never actually looked at it.

[22:54] tilgovi: twitter/irc is my nosql.com
[22:54] bingomanatee: no - thats not the site. 
[22:54] chapel: Couch uses a clever index building scheme to generate indexes which support particular queries.  There is an elegance to the approach, although one must predeclare these structures for each query one wants to execute.  One can think of them as materialized views. << thats the key imo
[22:54] tilgovi: chapel's got it right.
[22:54] bingomanatee: Is there a good nondenominational nosql news site?
[22:55] tilgovi: hehe. nondenominational. we're not that zealous are we?
[22:55] bingomanatee: I'm not trying to personalize the question. I have wanted to do a site like that and was wondering if there was a player in the space already. 
[22:55] chapel: tilgovi: and their saying that its a downside because mongo does it all dynamic, but you can send temporary views or even save them for further use
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[22:56] chapel: Both CouchDB and MongoDB support map/reduce operations.  For CouchDB map/reduce is inherent to the building of all views.  With MongoDB, map/reduce is only for data processing jobs but not for traditional queries.
[22:56] chapel: oh and bingomanatee
[22:56] bingomanatee: Yeah that seems curious to me. 
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[22:56] chapel: you can use commonjs modules with couchdb
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[22:57] bingomanatee: thats a win. 
[22:57] chapel: :)
[22:57] chapel: couchapps also rock
[22:57] bingomanatee: I don't have much love for node's mongo stuff. 
[22:57] bingomanatee: is that a data warehouse?
[22:57] pedrobelo has joined the channel
[22:57] chapel: couchapp?
[22:57] bingomanatee: or a product?
[22:57] chapel: couchapps are like making an app directly on the db
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[22:57] amirpc: using socket.io websockets does it somehow disable timer events when socket data is pending?
[22:57] chapel: instead of using something like ruby
[22:57] amirpc: I'm seeing my render loop stays interrupted while data is being processed from the server on my websocket client
[22:58] chapel: because with couchdb you can render your data as any format you want basically
[22:58] chapel: like html, xml, custom uml
[22:58] chapel: has binary attachment support
[22:58] bingomanatee: interesting. 
[22:59] tilgovi: yeah. couchdb is an html5/js application server as well as a database.
[22:59] bingomanatee: sounds nodey. 
[22:59] chapel: if you want to see what is awesome about couchapps, this is the next step http://kansojs.org/
[22:59] tilgovi: that's one of the things that makes it more interesting to me and makes me not care nearly as much about performance.
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[22:59] bingomanatee: That would kind of blow my clients mind but it would be a fun tool. 
[22:59] replz_: wow these captachs are hard to solve..
[23:00] Lorentz: replz_: It wouldn't be hard if you weren't a robot
[23:00] Lorentz: Robot
[23:00] tilgovi: chapel: kansojs looks cool. I hadn't seen it. Thanks.
[23:00] chapel: yeah its new
[23:00] chapel: caolanm made it
[23:00] replz_: Lorentz: are you calling me a robot?
[23:00] chapel: still wip
[23:00] chapel: but if you want to do a couchapp, it just makes sense
[23:00] Lorentz: replz_: We're all robots here
[23:01] chapel: since one issue with couchapps is having to write views in two places
[23:01] chapel: as _shows and on the client
[23:01] saschagehlich: does fs.readSync(fd, length, position, encoding) really return the amount of bytes that have been read? where does the data go then?
[23:01] replz_: Lorentz: I am a human
[23:02] replz_: Lorentz: and i have a question
[23:02] bingomanatee: Just another replicant poser. 
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[23:02] Lorentz: replz_: I will assume thing question is for me
[23:03] bingomanatee: Kansjs.org looks cool - I think I want to hold out on that til I get the basic model comfortable. 
[23:03] bingomanatee: But I like the flat stack approach. 
[23:03] mikeal: there is also node.couchapp.js
[23:03] replz_: how would you go about running a file (that creates a server) from a repl, and would that allow me to re-evaluate functions that would affect server behaviour at runtime?
[23:03] mikeal: it's less abstract, really close to the exact design doc structure with a sync tool
[23:04] chapel: yeah mikeal
[23:04] chapel: btw I told caolanm what you said
[23:04] chapel: he was going to look into what could be shared
[23:04] mikeal: yeah, i'd like to know what he said
[23:04] replz_: Lorentz: no, questions are for all the rob.. uuuh.. humans
[23:04] bingomanatee: I do want to ease in to the nodejs/kansjs approach - gotta hook them on the repo before I go obliterating their crappy PHP stack. 
[23:04] mikeal: like, if node.couchapp.js is doing something that prevents him from using it over the hood
[23:04] chapel: he did say that he doesn't do it exactly the same
[23:04] Lorentz: replz_: Good, because I don't know the answer
[23:04] mikeal: then i would consider than a bug
[23:04] mikeal: s/than/that
[23:04] chapel: yeah
[23:05] chapel: he comes on here often, caolanm on here
[23:05] mikeal: the goal is to get is less opinionated and really low level so you can build stuff like kanso without writing sync tools
[23:05] flukes1: how do I get node tests to output debug stuff
[23:05] bingomanatee: console.log?
[23:05] mikeal: flukes1: console.log :)
[23:05] bingomanatee: or file system log writing.
[23:05] flukes1: doesn't seem to be getting out to the console
[23:05] mikeal: or console.err will block
[23:05] bingomanatee: sys.out
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[23:05] mikeal: which is good fro debugging
[23:05] bingomanatee: or like I said - traditional result file logging.
[23:06] bingomanatee: the old ways are the best. 
[23:06] chapel: but yeah bingomanatee couchdb really is awesome, it isn't going to work for everything
[23:06] chapel: but once you get a hang of it, its really awesome
[23:06] flukes1: test-tls-server-verify seems to output nothing
[23:06] bingomanatee: Well my main concerns is I have a client with two develoers - one of whom he hates - and partitioning and scaling concerns. 
[23:06] flukes1: even if I manually insert a console.log at the top
[23:07] bingomanatee: I kind of need a package that takes care of that - I don't discriminate between a single package or a suite 
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[23:07] flukes1: does it do that if the test succeeds?
[23:07] bingomanatee: I just don't want to play DBA to a small house and just chop up their SQL tables becuase that is old and weak and lame. 
[23:08] chapel: bingomanatee: well you could potentially do the full stack as a couchapp
[23:08] chapel: oh bingomanatee
[23:08] chapel: _changes
[23:08] chapel: you really should look into _changes
[23:08] chapel: :)
[23:08] bingomanatee: I do like the integrated couch app stack and do want to downstream a node/nodesque scheme but I can't see dumping all of that new tech in one revision. 
[23:09] bingomanatee: that is cool. 
[23:09] psema4_ has joined the channel
[23:09] bingomanatee: Keep in mind for rev. 1 I am sure that sql will stay the system of record - I am basically using noSQL to slide out memcache and moving on from there. 
[23:10] jimt has joined the channel
[23:10] techwraith: tjholowaychuk: ping
[23:10] sechrist has joined the channel
[23:10] tjholowaychuk: hey
[23:10] bingomanatee: wow. 
[23:11] bingomanatee: angelinajolie: ping
[23:11] bingomanatee: ,,,,
[23:11] bingomanatee: WTF?
[23:11] drudge: man mongoose commits are crazy
[23:11] micheil: lol. we had madonna here before. 
[23:11] briznad1 has joined the channel
[23:11] bingomanatee: Nice to see her keeping it real 
[23:11] techwraith: tjholowaychuk: We're doing some CORS stuff, does connect have support for OPTIONS?
[23:11] sechrist has joined the channel
[23:11] tjholowaychuk: techwraith: yup
[23:12] techwraith: tjholowaychuk: Any chance it handles CORS automagically?
[23:12] tjholowaychuk: i believe there is a middleware that does most of it, not to sure
[23:12] tjholowaychuk: check the connect wik
[23:12] tjholowaychuk: i
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[23:15] bingomanatee: By the way - all you mongo heads - I am doing a query on my MongoDB database in noogle and the reverse sorting is srrewing up in christkov-native code - no results are being returned even though I can run the same query manually just fine in the console. 
[23:16] bingomanatee: I'll gist up an example. 
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[23:23] bingomanatee: is there an easy way to log mongo queries?
[23:23] mscdex: lol @ http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2011/01/26/internet-run-ip-addresses-happens-anyones-guess/
[23:23] mscdex: "Web developers have tried to compensate for this problem by creating IPv6 -- a system that recognizes six-digit IP addresses rather than four-digit ones."
[23:24] jtsnow: I'm using the node-mysql module. Anyone have suggestions on how to read data from a BLOB column?
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[23:28] bingomanatee: By the way - thanks to everyone for their input. 
[23:28] micheil: mscdex: china's already using ipv6, and access the internet through an ipv4 proxy
[23:28] ShizWeaK_: jtsnow: I'll give it a test in a minute - using node-mysql as we speak
[23:29] echosystm: i'm seeing some people write libraries like require('namespace/namespace/module');
[23:29] mscdex: jtsnow: from what i see there is no way to do binary data.... i thought this was fixed awhile back when i added support for it
[23:29] mscdex: :S
[23:29] echosystm: and then im seeing require('project').namespace.namespace.module;
[23:29] echosystm: what is the preffered way?
[23:29] mscdex: no namespaces
[23:29] mscdex: too java-y
[23:29] mscdex: :p
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[23:32] echosystm: i'm going to go with directories, so orthogonal code doesnt get imported
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[23:32] CarterA: Are there any node web servers that are suited to take over for nginx at this point? Ideally with vhost support and websockets.
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[23:35] mscdex: jtsnow: i think the main reason felixge may have poo-poo'ed the blob support was that there is no efficient way to append to a buffer
[23:36] jtsnow: mscdex: ok :( Guess I'll have to find a work around for now
[23:36] mscdex: i can create a patch for it if you want
[23:36] nolan_d has joined the channel
[23:37] nolan_d: I can't install npm because querystring is missing. Is this a known issue?
[23:37] nooder: anyone interested in node torrent tracker?
[23:37] halfhalo: crap.... node is crapping out on me
[23:37] jtsnow: mscdex: that'd be excellent
[23:37] isaacs: nlacasse: huh?
[23:37] isaacs: nlacasse: sorry, that was for nolan_d 
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[23:37] halfhalo: It freaking will not talk to a eucalyptus server without crashing
[23:38] nolan_d: isaacs: Checked out latest from git, ran "make install" but it gives a 404 on the querystring dependency.
[23:38] isaacs: nolan_d: works for me.  you sure you have the latest from git?
[23:39] nolan_d: Let me rm my repo and try again.
[23:39] nooder: nolan_d, no problem for me on master
[23:39] isaacs: oh, wait, make install works, but when i removed the bundle, i didn't update the package.json, just a second
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[23:40] isaacs: nolan_d: should work now.  pull from master.
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[23:41] nolan_d: Strange, it's still complaining about not finding querystring.
[23:42] nolan_d: which is odd since it isn't in the package.json.
[23:42] mscdex: jtsnow: ok one moment
[23:42] diegoviola: what's node written in, c?
[23:43] nolan_d: Wait, now it worked, wtf?
[23:43] diegoviola: the vm
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[23:43] eikke: diegoviola: the VM is Google's V8, written in C++, and all non-JS bits of Node are C++ as well
[23:44] nolan_d: OK, got it working. Next question, shouldn't updating a package remove old, unused versions? I wiped out my package dir because I had lots of each version installed and wasn't using older versions.
[23:44] sechrist has joined the channel
[23:44] flukes1: does test-tls-securepair-client fail for anyone else
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[23:48] slickplaid: Can someone help me understand how to render *only* the partial and not include the layout in Express? https://gist.github.com/96c110a0aba02e4a8424
[23:48] Coal has joined the channel
[23:49] ryah: props to anyone who can make this not suck: https://gist.github.com/797775
[23:49] ryah: shouldn't be very hard
[23:49] slickplaid: paint racing strips on it?
[23:50] sechrist has joined the channel
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[23:52] micheil: ryah: checking.
[23:52] micheil: ryah: write buffers?
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[23:53] micheil: erm, let me explain by write buffers, /I mean, write the data to a buffer (read array) first, then write out to disk
[23:53] ryah: well it's going to the thread pool for each write
[23:53] sechrist has joined the channel
[23:53] ryah: it has it all buffered
[23:53] ryah: it should be able to do it in one or two
[23:53] micheil: like writing to http
[23:54] micheil: possibly use a write delay
[23:54] micheil: or something.
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[23:54] slickplaid: split the file into 2-4 parts, writing to each async then merge it into one file? heh i dunno
[23:54] flukes1: test-tls-securepair-client seems to fail because server.stdout.on('data', ... doesn't get the "ACCEPT" which openssl sends to stdout
[23:55] micheil: either setTimeout or process.nextTick it.
[23:55] flukes1: on my machine at least. does anyone have this test working?
[23:55] slickplaid: Can someone help me understand how to render *only* the partial and not include the layout in Express? https://gist.github.com/96c110a0aba02e4a8424
[23:55] micheil: ryah: read: eventual write to disk.
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[23:56] micheil: add an option to WriteStream delay, if set to 0, automatically flushes to disk, otherwise, it sets a timeout to call flush after.
[23:56] tjholowaychuk: slickplaid: render(path, { layout: false })
[23:56] tjholowaychuk: might do the trick
[23:57] micheil: if another write call happens before then, clear the old timeout and set a new one
[23:57] slickplaid: Thanks :)
[23:57] tjholowaychuk: slickplaid: let me know if it doesnt work
[23:57] flukes1: ryah: see above
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[23:57] micheil: thrus pushing the not sucking of that example onto the user.
[23:57] slickplaid: Is that the preferred method for doing that? All I want to do is have an ajax call to /register return a blurb of html and then place it into the page
[23:57] ryah: micheil: making it not suck does not involve telling me how it could be made to not suck :)
[23:58] micheil: ryah: you want a pull request?
[23:58] ryah: yes
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[23:58] tjholowaychuk: slickplaid: it should work, partials are still just regular templates
[23:58] micheil: ryah: hmm..
[23:58] tjholowaychuk: slickplaid: might be nice to have a shortcut like res.renderOnly(path)
[23:58] slickplaid: good idea :)
[23:58] slickplaid: ty
[23:58] ryah: flukes1: which version of openssl?
[23:59] flukes1: OpenSSL 0.9.8l 5 Nov 2009
[23:59] slickplaid: Awesome. works great, thanks tjholowaychuk. :D
[23:59] flukes1: running it manually from terminal, it does print ACCEPT
[23:59] ryah: flukes1: openssl s_server has a bug prior to 1.0.0 which does not flush the "ACCEPT" 
[23:59] ryah: flukes1: but only on pipes
[23:59] ryah: flukes1: pipe it to cat
[23:59] micheil: ryah: okay, I'll have a to you soon, I think.
[23:59] flukes1: wow, that's one specific bug. ok thanks