[00:02] creationix: 
ACTION is designing yet another class library in js to understand why people make them.

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[00:06] creationix: "super" is especially hard to do right
[00:08] technoweenie: sh1mmer: i bet that riak-js behavior is for logging
[00:08] sh1mmer: technoweenie: oh?
[00:08] technoweenie: just a guess
[00:08] sh1mmer: why do you say that?
[00:08] technoweenie: so it can log something as its making the request
[00:08] technoweenie: not a good reason imo
[00:08] sh1mmer: that's not even close to a good reason
[00:09] technoweenie: frank seemed very open to refactoring 
[00:09] sh1mmer: I'm surprised no-one has hit it before
[00:09] sh1mmer: it seems like the sample code in the docs wouldn't even work correctly
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[00:16] creationix: http://gist.github.com/520067 Am I insane or brilliant?
[00:16] creationix: (not that those are mutually exclusive)
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[00:20] dannycoates: creationix: I like it, but I'm also a js noob
[00:20] creationix: dannycoates: I break all sorts of "rules", but the result is very clean
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[00:21] mde: Hot-wiring __proto__ is a little dubious, but yeah. :)
[00:21] creationix: what's dubious about it?
[00:21] creationix: assume a node only environment
[00:21] mde: If the end result does what you want, it's all good.
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[00:21] creationix: it's simple, efficient, and effective
[00:21] mde: Right, it's V8-specific. Actually I guess FF implements it the same way.
[00:21] mde: But it's not in the spec.
[00:22] creationix: yeah, pretty much everything that has canvas has __proto__
[00:22] creationix: 
ACTION wonders about IE9

[00:22] mde: I really don't mind "new," but as long as object-creation is clearly called out, it's all good.
[00:22] mde: Was it your chat with Crockford that got you going on this?
[00:23] creationix: my beef with the new keyword is the indirection
[00:23] creationix: it does a lot of stuff that's not needed
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[00:23] mde: It also give the classical people the illusion it does what they think it does.
[00:23] cardona507: w00t
[00:23] jesusabdullah: new is, umm, new?
[00:23] mde: Which is potentially a bad thing.
[00:24] creationix: new Foo(1,2,3) is the same as Foo.call(Object.create(Foo.prototype, {constructor:{value:Foo}}), 1, 2, 3)
[00:24] creationix: it's not classical, but a complicated trick bundled in syntax sugar
[00:26] creationix: mde: no, I've had it against constructors ever since I realized we don't need them in ES5
[00:27] creationix: But Crockford said that those of us wanting to simplify the language need to speak up, cause those wanting more features are being quite loud
[00:28] creationix: we really don't want static typing and real classes
[00:30] _announcer: Twitter: "@ryah Are there plans to expose V8's JS parser in node.js? ASTs are kind of mandatory to resolve dependencies of client-side modules." -- Tobie Langel. http://twitter.com/tobie/status/20929988895
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[00:35] _announcer: Twitter: "node.js modules do I write a static file serving as the use of beats in class Buffer" [ja] -- atsuya. http://twitter.com/atsuya/status/20930349334
[00:35] dannycoates: how are ASTs mandatory for resolving dependencies? isn't 'require' enough?
[00:37] _announcer: Twitter: "Google tech talk - Node.js: JavaScript on the Server http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6k8lTrAE2g&sns=tw" -- Frodo. http://twitter.com/skyizblue/status/20930498864
[00:38] mde: creationix: He was spot-on about static typing and fixed-property inheritance.
[00:38] mde: O
[00:39] creationix: is __proto__ really slow?
[00:39] mde: I've had to use AS3, which is what we'd have ended up with, if the "fix JS by turning it into Java" crowd had succeeeded.
[00:39] creationix: mde: I've used that and haXe
[00:39] mde: Crockford was instrumental in quashing that.
[00:39] creationix: I think haXe is done a little better, but I still prefer ES5
[00:40] mde: I was struck by the difference in posture in this last vid from Brendan about the future of JS.
[00:40] creationix: yeah
[00:41] mde: Before he seemed convinced that he knew what we needed to fix it, which was a lot of the ES4 stuff.
[00:41] mde: And this time around, he was more like "let's try some stuff, and see what works best."
[00:41] creationix: mde: do you think I could get away with my little experiment in a real project or will people cry dirty when they see my __proto__ and Object.prototype hacks
[00:41] creationix: mde: yeah, ES4 was a sad failure
[00:42] mde: creationix: There will be people who don't like stuff that takes back-door approaches, sure.
[00:42] mde: I tend to want to write plain JS, because you never know when it's going to end up being used in a different environment.
[00:42] mde: I don't want to write code that depends on special features.
[00:42] creationix: I do too, but this seems it will be so much easier and straightforward to use
[00:43] creationix: and I'm if my code doesn't run in IE
[00:43] tjholowaychuk: ditto. ive written a few different class implemtentations for different envs, but at the end of the day its all lame
[00:43] mde: Right, I just like writing plain old idiomatic JS. :)
[00:43] creationix: this is plain prototypal js, but with some syntax sugar using Object.prototype
[00:44] shimondoodkin: creationix: http://gist.github.com/520067#gistcomment-7334
[00:44] mde: But if you *know* you'll never have to support this stuff in IE, or AIR, or other places, you should do whatever makes you happy. 
[00:44] mde: Only danger is maybe new people getting confused, because they don't know the difference.
[00:44] creationix: shimondoodkin: no, it's not that easy
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[00:45] guybrush: javascript != javascript, i think its well known that javascript doesnt work the same everywhere
[00:45] creationix: shimondoodkin: Object.getOwnPropertyNames and Object. getOwnPropertyDescriptor are your friends
[00:45] guybrush: also to new people
[00:46] ThePub: Sure would be great if it did :)
[00:47] mde: guybrush: If you stick to plain JS -- not talking DOM or XHR or whatever -- it pretty much works the same everywhere. 
[00:47] tjholowaychuk: 
ACTION goes to delete class implementations because they need to die

[00:47] mde: tjholowaychuk: +1, we don't need faux classes. :)
[00:47] tjholowaychuk: me: agreed
[00:47] tjholowaychuk: just an extra dependency
[00:47] mde: Goes against the grain, and "doesn't mean what you think it means." :)
[00:48] mikeal1: anyone here use sammy?
[00:50] creationix: tjholowaychuk: do you consider my two helpers a "class" implementation
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[00:50] creationix: mikeal1: I did before
[00:50] mikeal1: it's not picking up hash changes in realtime
[00:50] tjholowaychuk: creationix: regardless its still a dependency
[00:50] creationix: mikeal1: what browser
[00:50] tjholowaychuk: *needless
[00:51] creationix: tjholowaychuk: perhaps, but all large programs factor common patterns into utilities
[00:51] creationix: that's just good programming
[00:52] creationix: mikeal1: on some browsers it's polls the window.location.hash
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[00:52] creationix: since not all implement onhashchange
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[00:56] daleharvey: there is a new nice html5 way to do hash navigation
[00:56] _announcer: Twitter: "(video) Data throttling in node.js. http://northpole.sg/45 (thanks to Matt Ranney!)" -- Kenny Shen. http://twitter.com/kenny_shen/status/20931794562
[00:57] _announcer: Twitter: "@deepthawtz lol, i see u in the node.js meetup video. nice cap :P" -- Kenny Shen. http://twitter.com/kenny_shen/status/20931846319
[00:57] mikeal1: creationix: it's polling
[00:57] mikeal1: but as soon as the hash changes, the interval callback stops firing
[00:58] creationix: mikeal1: oh, I haven't seen that bug, sorry
[00:58] _announcer: Twitter: "Very frustrated trying to get Jasmine tests to run in node.js. Despite two related (but poorly documented) modules on github." -- Ben Rady. http://twitter.com/benrady/status/20931900812
[01:01] creationix: mikeal1: I assume you already tried the sammy room
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[01:02] shimondoodkin: how to do something like Object.undefineProperty 
[01:02] mikeal1: yup
[01:03] ThePub: Is there some unique ID related to http requests I can use to identify them individually?  Probably a silly question  :)
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[01:04] shimondoodkin: will Object.defineProperty copy references?
[01:05] phoenix24: which is the best available nodejs library for making a socket server ?
[01:05] wattz: nodejs
[01:05] ChrisPartridge: heh
[01:06] hobson: ThePub: you can use cookies, if you don't mind making up the unique id on your end.
[01:06] bradleymeck: Object.defineProperty will not copy anything
[01:07] phoenix24: wattz: socket-io / socket-io-node ?
[01:07] bradleymeck: phoenix24 for speed, node-websocket-server, for fallbacks socket.io
[01:08] phoenix24: ok, thanks bradleymeck 
[01:08] wattz: taking a break from "Bob the builder" tonight
[01:08] wattz: just have to put the task/checks in and it should be good for testing for a bit
[01:08] bradleymeck: can we fix it?
[01:08] wattz: YES WE CAN
[01:08] bradleymeck: hehe
[01:08] wattz: bradleymeck: it's my builder
[01:10] bradleymeck: imma take another stab at extjs, anyone recommend a full fledged tutorial
[01:10] wattz: wanna peak?ew
[01:10] wattz: oops
[01:10] wattz: extjs?
[01:10] shimondoodkin: i am imlementing an inplace copy of an object, i think i need some help here. http://github.com/shimondoodkin/node-hot-reload/blob/master/index.js#L90
[01:10] bradleymeck: sencha's browser lib
[01:11] bradleymeck: inplace and copy seem contradictory. you mean a deep copy?
[01:12] shimondoodkin: what is deep copy?
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[01:12] bradleymeck: copy an object, and all subobjects into a new one
[01:13] bradleymeck: or do you want to hold a reference and make it mirror another object's properties
[01:13] _announcer: Twitter: "the talks from yesterday's node.js meetup http://vimeo.com/14071325" -- Dylan Clendenin. http://twitter.com/deepthawtz/status/20932941487
[01:13] shimondoodkin: just copy all subobjects from a new one into an old one and make the old one be the new one
[01:13] shimondoodkin: because all references are to the old object
[01:15] shimondoodkin: i am tring to solve this problem: is there a way to update all  references of an object? for example: y={who:'old'};x=y;z=y; if i change y={who:'new'}, then x and z still hold the old object...
[01:15] shimondoodkin: i want all the objects have the new value
[01:16] bradleymeck: k, sec writing
[01:17] ThePub: okie
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[01:19] ivan: is destructuring in ES5?
[01:19] bradleymeck: what do you mean destructuring
[01:20] ashleydev has joined the channel
[01:20] ivan: x, y = [1, 2];
[01:20] dannycoates: ivan: its not
[01:20] ivan: :( thanks
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[01:21] shimondoodkin: looks like math
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[01:23] dannycoates: destructuring is pretty cool, a lot of functional langs have it
[01:24] bradleymeck: shimondoodkin, http://gist.github.com/520133 has all the logic, not tested
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[01:24] _announcer: Twitter: "Ryan Dahl interview @nodejs creator http://dailyjs.com/2010/08/10/ryan-dahl-interview/ only text.. Audio would be better :)" -- Butu. http://twitter.com/butu5/status/20933661847
[01:24] bradleymeck: copy on write slices for arrays! rabble rabble!
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[01:25] JimBastard: h̺͖̥̼̤̦̖̯͈͖͎̺̗̹̗̗̙̊͋̾̃̈̇̏̿̃͒e̜̠͖̭̭͉͔͓̰̞̞͔͚͕̝̤̦͎͉̯͖͎̪͓̰̞̠̝͖̜͈̝̖̘̝͍̩̝̝͙̰̲̭̗͙͎̹̻͇̦̙̗̭̰̪̘͉̟̺̯̤͈̱̺̥ͤ͗̑̾̇ͨ̒̀̓͒̊ͅͅl̻̠̭͖̪̥̙̬̖̻̤̟̞̭̹̘̪̤ͯ͐̇̒̇̑̐͛͛̒ͫ͂̋̒̍̔̚l̝̙̠͖͔̤̬͉̰͖̞͇̤̙̣͔̟͇̳̩̜̼̪͈͓̩̠̦̭̟͚̗̺͎͙͈̱̫̰̱̞̈ͤ̒̽́̿ͤͩ͗̅͋́o̤̰͈̥̠̪̞̗̲͉̯̳̤̥̭͖̠̰̦͖�
[01:25] JimBastard: i really shouldnt be allowed on the internet
[01:25] bradleymeck: aaaah devil
[01:25] bradleymeck:  /cry they are going to add strict mode to v8
[01:25] JimBastard: :p
[01:26] sh1mmer: creationix: explain that tweet.
[01:26] creationix: I finally realized what's really at stake
[01:26] bradleymeck: huh
[01:26] creationix: bradleymeck: it's very offtopic for this room
[01:27] sh1mmer: bradleymeck: this is OT. Read his stream
[01:27] bradleymeck: cool
[01:27] wattz: JimBastard: you are like the Chris Walken of the webz
[01:27] JimBastard_ has joined the channel
[01:27] shimondoodkin: bradleymeck: thanks
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[01:30] shimondoodkin: JimBastard all i see is a long line of puntuation signs from different langages. it does not works as intented.
[01:31] JimBastard_: shimondoodkin: yeah its not 100%, im gonna stop doing it in the irc room too
[01:31] JimBastard_: shimondoodkin: its suppose to look like this, http://hunch.se/s/85/42thd5e9s0408.png
[01:31] JimBastard_: what is your os / browser?
[01:31] JimBastard_: linux chrome?
[01:31] shimondoodkin: JimBastard: google will investigate you
[01:31] JimBastard_: windows firefox?
[01:31] JimBastard_: shimondoodkin: i only worry about federal entities 
[01:32] JimBastard_: or countries that extradite 
[01:32] shimondoodkin: i saw this in groups
[01:32] shimondoodkin: google groups
[01:33] JimBastard_: you mean my post from earlier today?
[01:33] shimondoodkin: yep
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[01:34] JimBastard_: yeah, i really doubt google gives a fuck at all
[01:35] shimondoodkin: bradleymeck: what did you ment "//cant stop a seal / freeze"
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[01:37] bradleymeck: Object.seal/Object.freeze on the mirror will result in it not being able to copy correctly
[01:40] shimondoodkin: so you mean that if the mirror is seald it will not work, right?
[01:42] bradleymeck: yes, and various other Object.defineProperty combos will stop that model from working
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[01:43] bradleymeck: but as long as you dont have those happen, you are peachy
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[02:01] CIA-77: node: 03Bert Belder 07master * r7059be1 10/ (15 files): 
[02:01] CIA-77: node: Fix http and net tests failing due to race condition
[02:01] CIA-77: node: Plus some minor cosmetic corrections - http://bit.ly/aUEj4y
[02:02] CIA-77: node: 03Rasmus Andersson 07master * r8d5e056 10/ (src/node_net.cc test/simple/test-dgram-multicast.js): 
[02:02] CIA-77: node: Added support for multiple listeners to DNS multicast datagrams.
[02:02] CIA-77: node: Some platforms require SO_REUSEPORT to be set for the socket. - http://bit.ly/cBwN3L
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[02:06] _announcer: Twitter: "@ KOBA789 speak of what a server control that? node.js" [ja] -- _X_y_z_/X(エクス). http://twitter.com/x_h_/status/20936640909
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[02:08] sh1mmer: technoweenie: I'm trying to root out     Riak.prototype.executeInternal(self, path, options, callback);
[02:09] sh1mmer: nm I'm a dumbass
[02:09] _announcer: Twitter: "s multi-process node.js / a thread? What would you be concerned about how that parallelism. V8 to me in multiple threads simultaneously 使Enakatta" [ja] -- 封獣ぬる. http://twitter.com/nullkal/status/20936856555
[02:11] technoweenie: sh1mmer: not sure, thats something i want to refactor :)
[02:11] sh1mmer: technoweenie: I was looking at it thought I might patch it so I can work
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[02:11] sh1mmer: technoweenie: although I was considering fucking you all and trying tokyo tyrant :P
[02:12] technoweenie: how about just try tokyo tyrant and not fuck us
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[02:12] sh1mmer: if that's the way it must be
[02:12] technoweenie: makes no difference to mee
[02:12] technoweenie: tokyo tyrant, not the fucking
[02:12] sh1mmer: awesome. in that case I'll see you at the next drinkup
[02:12] sh1mmer: big boy.
[02:12] sh1mmer: scratch that.
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[02:13] technoweenie: also the tokyo cabinet author himself deprecated it :)
[02:13] technoweenie: http://fallabs.com/kyotocabinet/
[02:13] sh1mmer: right
[02:13] sh1mmer: I was about to say
[02:13] sh1mmer: It's Kyoto Cabinet now, right
[02:14] technoweenie: wait are you sure about riak-js
[02:14] sh1mmer: sure about what?
[02:14] technoweenie: seriousness aside: http://github.com/frank06/riak-js/blob/master/lib/riak-node.js#L60-69
[02:15] sh1mmer: oh. so I should be adding listeners instead of using the returned callback?
[02:15] technoweenie: no
[02:15] technoweenie: that's the same callback
[02:16] sh1mmer: hm
[02:16] technoweenie: http://github.com/frank06/riak-js/blob/master/lib/riak.js#L308
[02:16] sh1mmer: right
[02:17] technoweenie: so i would say your initial analysis is incorrect
[02:17] technoweenie: let me set some shit up and i'll try it
[02:17] technoweenie: you are on master right
[02:17] tocho-san has joined the channel
[02:17] technoweenie: (i havent actually used riak-js lol)
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[02:18] sh1mmer: technoweenie: I used npm
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[02:20] SamNZ: Can I have multiple versions of node installed at once?
[02:20] sh1mmer: sure
[02:20] technoweenie: SamNZ: you can install node multiple times the same way you can install anything multiple times
[02:20] technoweenie: you can install it to custom prefixes, or with a custom prefix
[02:21] technoweenie: but none of that is specific to node
[02:21] technoweenie: sh1mmer: ah, well i have no idea how recent npm is.  
[02:21] JimBastard_: SamNZ: you might be interested in some of the tools that help manage multiple node instances
[02:21] SamNZ: And give one another name? like node_edge or something?
[02:21] sh1mmer: technoweenie: I'm testing from head now
[02:21] JimBastard_: SamNZ: like http://github.com/isaacs/nave
[02:21] JimBastard_: and i think there is another one
[02:22] SamNZ: JimBastard_:  Thanks
[02:22] _announcer: Twitter: "I want to learn #nodejs just so I can apply to this awesome job http://bit.ly/97T9dp" -- Shane Reustle. http://twitter.com/Reustle/status/20937771528
[02:22] technoweenie: sh1mmer: http://github.com/frank06/riak-js/compare/v0.2.2...master#diff-12
[02:22] technoweenie: doesnt look like it changed from 0.2.2
[02:22] matt_c: "job description contains ASCII art" is the next addition to The Joel Test.
[02:23] technoweenie: i really want something like rvm, but nvm doesnt work with zsh
[02:23] JimBastard_: ahahahaha , best twitter ever
[02:23] technoweenie: matt_c: but the job asked for ninjas -5
[02:23] SamNZ: node ninjas
[02:23] matt_c: Ninjas are so hard to hire though.  You can never put your hands on them.
[02:23] shimondoodkin: is there a way to get the correct parse error from process.binding('evals').Script.runInNewContext(wrapper, sandbox, filename);
[02:24] technoweenie: matt_c: $$$$
[02:24] technoweenie: hired assassins like in ancient japan
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[02:26] JimBastard_: we are actually looking for ninja apprentices, not fully recognized ninjas. 
[02:27] JimBastard_: you cant hire a real ninja, they just show up in your office one morning while the whole place is still locked up
[02:27] JimBastard_: they have fixed all the issues in your issue tracker
[02:27] JimBastard_: and made you a coffee
[02:27] isaacs_mobile has joined the channel
[02:28] mde: At Yammer we're looking to hire JavaScript jet-fighter pilots.
[02:28] mde: And JavaScript lion-tamers.
[02:28] mde: And ... um, JavaScript ... Romulan starship captains.
[02:28] technoweenie: omg ninjas are so awesome http://realultimatepower.net/
[02:28] JimBastard_: i clicked no, 
[02:28] JimBastard_: OPRPA!
[02:29] technoweenie: If you don't believe that ninjas have REAL Ultimate Power you better get a life right now or they will chop your head off!!!  It's an easy choice, if you ask me.
[02:29] ChrisPartridge: JimBastard_: I didn't know making coffee was in a ninjas skill set
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[02:29] matt_c: ChrisPartridge: there's usually a barista tied up in the corner when they're done.
[02:30] mde: And ... um, JavaScript avant-garde film-music composers.
[02:30] JimBastard_: hee hee
[02:30] JimBastard_: our new office has a barista bar.....
[02:30] JimBastard_: mde: i'm an expert at dramascript, does that count?
[02:30] _announcer: Twitter: "@creationix Please please please stick to tech & @nodejs" -- Michael Payne. http://twitter.com/hartley/status/20938393596
[02:30] ChrisPartridge: Bastard! I'm just trying to get a expresso machine
[02:30] mde: Haha JimBastard_, nicely done. :)
[02:31] JimBastard_: :p
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[02:34] ChrisPartridge: Anyone know of any *decent* alternatives to Adobe AIR?
[02:34] shimondoodkin: flash projector
[02:34] mde: Titanium? XUL?
[02:35] shimondoodkin: flash project
[02:35] JimBastard_: there is no AVM, just XUUUUUUUUUUL
[02:35] JimBastard_: ChrisPartridge: i would say titanium though
[02:35] shimondoodkin: also there is some firm has a software for packging for flash to exe
[02:36] JimBastard_: i have a friend who commits to it, and he loves that shit
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[02:36] _announcer: Twitter: "great presentation in senchalabs about data throttling in nodejs http://vimeo.com/14071325" -- Camilo Aguilar. http://twitter.com/c4milo/status/20938800308
[02:36] ChrisPartridge: How have i not seen titanium
[02:37] JimBastard_: open source moves fast
[02:37] ChrisPartridge: opposed to my brain moving slow
[02:37] JimBastard_: but i think one of the main benefits of using titanium like approaches is that you dont have to rewrite your app
[02:37] JimBastard_: since its html5, it just works in browsers and stuff (in theory)
[02:37] ChrisPartridge: Yeah thats the whole idea
[02:38] mde: ChrisPartridge: You can write a JS app with AIR.
[02:38] mde: It doesn't have to be AS. 
[02:42] shimondoodkin: titanium looks good
[02:43] victorstan has joined the channel
[02:43] ChrisPartridge: mde: yeah, not to keen on the air API
[02:44] _announcer: Twitter: "I'm diggin' Node.js. Can't wait to really to it to the test." -- ryanewing. http://twitter.com/ryanewing/status/20939379596
[02:45] cardona507 has joined the channel
[02:47] _announcer: Twitter: "A console-based JavaScripty web client utility (using node.js) http://post.ly/rNqG" -- Ivan Ribeiro. http://twitter.com/irr/status/20939631074
[02:48] mde: ChrisPartridge: I'm not a fan either. Not native, not in the browser. It's just kind of weird.
[02:48] saikat: is there a way in node to get the path to the script that i'm running?
[02:48] saikat: so if i want to open a file relative to where the script is, i do something like fs.readFile(mypath + "file.txt")
[02:49] saikat: process.cwd gives me the path (i believe) from which i started the process and execPath gives me the path to node
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[02:50] mde: saikat: http://nodejs.org/api.html#__filename-49
[02:50] saikat: ah great, thanks
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[02:55] ChrisPartridge: mde: Yeah, weird is the only way to explain it. Titanium looks much nicer
[02:56] _announcer: Twitter: "Twitter is suggest I am need follow @ryah. Is he finish write new NoSQL distributed self-heal database in node.js?" -- DevOps Borat. http://twitter.com/DEVOPS_BORAT/status/20940295415
[02:58] _announcer: Twitter: "Super alpha support for fork() in node.js http://bit.ly/9qcuqx lots of edge cases that still need to be tested for... file issues!" -- konobi. http://twitter.com/konobi/status/20940392980
[03:00] JimBastard_: ahahaha DEVLOP_BORAT
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[03:06] Tim_Smart: Anyone here tried and used https with http.Client?
[03:06] sh1mmer has joined the channel
[03:07] JimBastard_: Tim_Smart: yeah
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[03:07] JimBastard_: http://github.com/nodejitsu/node-cloudservers
[03:07] Tim_Smart: OK. I just set the secure flag to true, anything else I'm missing?
[03:08] hobson has joined the channel
[03:08] JimBastard_: Tim_Smart: i'd take a look at indexzero's code there
[03:08] JimBastard_: we are having issues POST and PUT atm
[03:08] JimBastard_: GET is working
[03:08] JimBastard_: :-\
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[03:15] Tim_Smart: JimBastard_: Where the the module 'request'? http://github.com/nodejitsu/node-cloudservers/blob/master/lib/cloudservers/core.js#L12
[03:16] JimBastard_: Tim_Smart: one sec
[03:16] Tim_Smart: Got it - nvm.
[03:16] JimBastard_: Tim_Smart: http://github.com/mikeal/node-utils/tree/master/request/
[03:16] JimBastard_: its good stuff
[03:16] Tim_Smart: Yeah. Its on npm too.
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[03:25] _announcer: Twitter: "I like tempalias better than Mailinator. And, it's node.js: http://tempalias.com" -- Dmitry Kichenko. http://twitter.com/imissmyjuno/status/20942332190
[03:25] ThePub: man -w $REQ | groff -T html > out.html
[03:25] ThePub: oops
[03:27] robotarmy has joined the channel
[03:27] _announcer: Twitter: "Published "extreme beta" of next #jsmeter base code using #nodejs, more to come http://web.me.com/noahpeters" -- Noah Peters. http://twitter.com/noahpeters/status/20942529955
[03:32] _announcer: Twitter: "having a spin around the block with node.js" -- Simon Fell. http://twitter.com/superfell/status/20942846859
[03:37] ThePub: there isn't an easier way to get the output of a complex commandline argument other than just breaking it down using spawn?
[03:39] joshbuddy_ has joined the channel
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[03:40] ThePub: oh nm.. I'm an idiot :)  helps to rtfm  ^_^
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[03:43] mikecampo: can someone point me to the logs for this channel? I remember stumbling on a site that hosts them, but can't find it now.
[03:43] chrischris has joined the channel
[03:43] shimondoodkin: http://nodejs.debuggable.com/
[03:43] mikecampo: thank you sir
[03:45] JimBastard_: hey hey mikecampo 
[03:45] JimBastard_: check out http://stats.nodejs.se/ too
[03:47] mikecampo: JimBastard: haha, nice
[03:47] mikecampo: JimBastard: looks like you're winning
[03:48] shimondoodkin: now there is a new competition: twitter
[03:48] shimondoodkin: http://nodejs.se/
[03:52] alcuadrado has joined the channel
[03:53] shimondoodkin: s/now/ also looks like maybe now/
[03:54] JimBastard_: mikecampo: you playing with faker.js at all :-)
[03:55] JimBastard_: i hear that marak guy is a crazy
[03:58] mikecampo: JimBastard: i just found that project tonight actually! :P
[03:59] JimBastard_: ahaha i know its mine >.<
[03:59] JimBastard_: welcome to the node room
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[04:10] alcuadrado: Hi node comunity, it's me again with some prototypal inheritance questions :)
[04:10] alcuadrado: How do I manage encapsulation with this approach?
[04:12] ThePub: there aren't privacy settings in js, suppose you manage it the way Python does :)
[04:12] JimBastard_: alcuadrado: http://eloquentjavascript.net/contents.html
[04:13] JimBastard_: alcuadrado: http://eloquentjavascript.net/chapter6.html
[04:13] JimBastard_: fuck prototype
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[04:14] alcuadrado: hehe earlyer today everybody said prototypes are THE wat
[04:14] alcuadrado: way
[04:14] alcuadrado: let me read those links
[04:15] JimBastard_: alcuadrado: there is a lot of info about prototypical inheritance on the google
[04:15] JimBastard_: but its not like thats the only way to do it
[04:16] JimBastard_: http://eloquentjavascript.net/chapter8.html
[04:16] alcuadrado: I know it's not the only way, sure
[04:16] alcuadrado: but seems interesting
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[04:21] alcuadrado: JimBastard, so your approach to javascript is a more pure functional way?
[04:21] JimBastard_: yeah
[04:21] JimBastard_: closures all the way down
[04:22] JimBastard_: then i break encapsulation for fun 
[04:22] alcuadrado: can I make you some questions about it?
[04:22] JimBastard_: im kinda busy, whats up?
[04:22] alcuadrado: that's ok, keep working so...
[04:23] alcuadrado: they were some theoretical things I saw at my CS courses
[04:23] technowe_: http://www.crockford.com/javascript/private.html
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[04:29] JimBastard_: creationix is there basic http auth built into connect?
[04:29] JimBastard_: as a middleware?
[04:30] sh1mmer: alcuadrado: module pattern, yo
[04:30] sh1mmer: http://www.yuiblog.com/blog/2007/06/12/module-pattern/
[04:32] alcuadrado: there's a big problem with javascript
[04:32] creationix: JimBastard_: I think there is a third-party middleware
[04:32] creationix: nothing built-in
[04:32] alcuadrado: one you enter an intersting link you finde another, and another, until your brain says stack overflow
[04:32] sh1mmer: alcuadrado: which one?
[04:32] alcuadrado: when yo enter*
[04:33] sh1mmer: alcuadrado: buy a copy of the good parts
[04:33] sh1mmer: and read that
[04:33] JimBastard_: creationix: thanks
[04:33] sh1mmer: Stoyan's book is also good: Objected Oriented JavaScript
[04:33] derferman has joined the channel
[04:33] alcuadrado: I've read half of the good parts, I have to finish it, but it's hard with work and collage :p
[04:33] technowe_: alcuadrado: programming is tough
[04:33] ChrisPartridge: creationix: Is there a list somewhere of 3rd party middleware for connect?
[04:34] _announcer: Twitter: "Just updated to the latest NodeJS...let the fun begin :)" -- Sonny Scroggin. http://twitter.com/scrogson/status/20946993381
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[04:34] alcuadrado: technowe_, didn't get your comment? :s
[04:34] creationix: sh1mmer: I would love to read "the good parts"
[04:34] creationix: ;)
[04:35] sh1mmer: creationix: want a link to amazon?
[04:35] creationix: ChrisPartridge: sure, on git github wiki for connect
[04:35] creationix: sh1mmer: nah I can find it, I was hinting you get me one
[04:36] _announcer: Twitter: "@ericholscher was this client side stuff, or node.js?" -- Justin Lilly. http://twitter.com/justinlilly/status/20947127929
[04:36] sh1mmer: creationix: I know. I was gently rebuffing you without point out what a cheapskate you are
[04:37] creationix: I'l be much less of a cheapscape when my house in Texas sells
[04:38] JimBastard_: ahahaha
[04:38] freshtonic has joined the channel
[04:38] JimBastard_: creationix: im thinking of wrapping up a bunch of middlewares but not having any glue for them
[04:39] JimBastard_: does that make any sense? it seems you guys have a lot okay ones already in conncet
[04:39] JimBastard_: connect*
[04:39] creationix: JimBastard_: using connect middlewares without connect
[04:39] JimBastard_: yeah, plus more, and maybe a very light DSL or something
[04:39] creationix: JimBastard_: yeah, that should work, they are pretty easy to use
[04:40] brianleroux has joined the channel
[04:41] JimBastard_: hey check this out, indexzero built a jQuerify method for jsdom
[04:41] JimBastard_: http://gist.github.com/520317
[04:42] JimBastard_: so now you can just inject jQuery into a jsdom window, the same way the jQueryify bookmarklet works
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[04:45] genbit: Hi, who can help, i have problem with node-iconv lib, when i try require("node-iconv"), i get this error: Error: /usr/local/lib/node/iconv.node: undefined symbol: _ZN2v88internal9Internals13kJSObjectTypeE
[04:45] genbit: this lib: http://github.com/bnoordhuis/node-iconv
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[04:47] _announcer: Twitter: "How NodeJS saved my web application: http://rfw.posterous.com/how-nodejs-saved-my-web-application" -- zaca rias. http://twitter.com/zacaster/status/20947814489
[04:47] genbit: I see this error only on one of my ubuntu machine, on my second machine - all ok
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[04:57] ryah: genbit: node-waf clean configure build
[05:00] tjgillies has joined the channel
[05:00] genbit: ryah, thanks!
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[05:03] EyePulp: so I'm starting from scratch and building an IM -ish client/server app.  Looking for recommendations on the url routing module
[05:04] jimt has joined the channel
[05:05] JimBastard_: EyePulp: i like http://github.com/cloudhead/journey
[05:05] JimBastard_: since its json only
[05:05] JimBastard_: if your backend is returning not json i hate you
[05:05] EyePulp: heh
[05:06] JimBastard_: seriously though, you should be templating in the client
[05:06] JimBastard_: ;-)
[05:07] EyePulp: well, I still have to serve some static stuff, and for dev it would be nice to roll it all up in node
[05:07] EyePulp: for prod I can serve the static files from elsewhere
[05:07] SamNZ: My new favourite way of constructing objects in Javascript: http://gist.github.com/520345
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[05:12] EyePulp: JimBastard_: can I mix routers?  I mean on the same port?  
[05:12] Tim_Smart has joined the channel
[05:12] JimBastard_: EyePulp: i dont know what ya ma
[05:12] JimBastard_: an
[05:14] EyePulp: JimBastard_:  bear with my ignorance - don't you set routers up as listeners on a port, and they look for a pattern of the request url, and if they find a match they answer it? I'm curious if you could (or should) mix two routers if you need features from both.
[05:14] JimBastard_: routers route stuff
[05:15] JimBastard_: things like ports and servers are somewhat decoupled
[05:15] JimBastard_: journey will listen on one port, using ont http server, and route urls for that
[05:15] JimBastard_: what do you need to do
[05:18] EyePulp: JimBastard_: really just trying to learn terms and roles within the node world.  the overall goal is a managed IM/chat framework across http, but tonight we start small - e.g. how much should I write from scratch, and how much should be built on the shoulders of giants.  
[05:18] JimBastard_: EyePulp: i've built javascript im from scratch before
[05:18] JimBastard_: using long pollings and ajax
[05:19] JimBastard_: you prob wanna do a bit more planning before diving into code
[05:19] JimBastard_: you gonna use websockets?
[05:19] EyePulp: JimBastard_:  As I understood websockets aren't too available in some of the bigger browsers
[05:19] EyePulp: though there are some client side libs to improve that
[05:20] JimBastard_: there are ways to have flash fallback support, i think libraries like socket.io do this
[05:20] JimBastard_: i prefer long polling if possible, but thats just me
[05:20] EyePulp: I'm happy with a long-polling solution for phase 1
[05:20] JimBastard_: it should be noted that there are a few ajax im frameworks out there with node pieces
[05:20] JimBastard_: dunno if any will suite your needs
[05:20] EyePulp: I plan on using mongo for conversation logging
[05:21] EyePulp: I'm okay building this, but it will take me a bit of time to learn my way around
[05:22] EyePulp: so far everything seems to be a comfortable fit with node
[05:22] JimBastard_: journey might be a good start, you setup some basic routes to do stuff like login and send message and get messages
[05:22] JimBastard_: the node-chat stuff is kinda sexy though
[05:22] JimBastard_: http://chat.nodejitsu.com/
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[05:23] EyePulp: is that the same node chat as the demo code that comes with node?
[05:23] EyePulp: the one on github, I mean
[05:24] JimBastard_: keep trying
[05:24] JimBastard_: theres a few on github
[05:24] JimBastard_: this is scott g's
[05:24] JimBastard_: http://github.com/scottgonzalez/node-chat/
[05:24] JimBastard_: ry has one too
[05:24] EyePulp: heh - I'm thinking of the really basic one tha tI think was ry's
[05:25] JimBastard_: yeah, just code that shit
[05:25] JimBastard_: do it
[05:26] EyePulp: heh
[05:26] EyePulp: I've been building django projects the last 2 years, and classic ASP before that.  Node is new ground.
[05:26] JimBastard_: just make it all work in memory first
[05:27] JimBastard_: one file, 50 lines
[05:27] EyePulp: you mean before tying to a DB?
[05:27] JimBastard_: i dunno
[05:27] SamuraiJack has joined the channel
[05:27] SubStack: yeah, you can always hack in a db later
[05:27] EyePulp: sure
[05:27] JimBastard_: better to get something working, then get stuck trying to install mongo-native 
[05:28] jimt has joined the channel
[05:28] EyePulp: agreed
[05:29] EyePulp: chacking out scott g's node-chat
[05:29] EyePulp: *checking
[05:29] JimBastard_: scott is pretty fucking good at jquery
[05:31] creationix: join #javascript
[05:32] creationix: oops, missing /
[05:33] _announcer: Twitter: "@voodootikigod Hi! Can you please take a look at this: http://bit.ly/ab4aKv This is extremely fast tmpl engine for node.js w native compiler" -- Fedor Indutny. http://twitter.com/indutny/status/20950556889
[05:35] dgathright has joined the channel
[05:41] mape: That dude sure is persistant, hehe
[05:41] elliottcable: srsly.
[05:41] elliottcable: spotify:album:3WPrawXpaCipth5ZBafLE8
[05:41] elliottcable: so beautiful ;_;
[05:44] JimBastard_: lol
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[05:48] _announcer: Twitter: "Just used the node.js repl, and holy shit! Tab completion, and (remember I've been out of it for 2m) a context that lasts more than 1 line!" -- Benjamin Thomas. http://twitter.com/bentomas/status/20951387358
[05:49] ehaas has joined the channel
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[05:53] elliottcable: new repl? o_O
[05:54] mape: tab completion was landed yesterday
[05:54] Tim_Smart: zomg I are must update!
[05:54] Tim_Smart: now!
[05:55] hansek has joined the channel
[05:55] JimBastard_: yeah, meh
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[06:01] _announcer: Twitter: "@kuvos @indutny nTPL - extremely fast & extendable node.js template engine with native parser http://bit.ly/ab4aKv" -- Fedor Indutny. http://twitter.com/indutny/status/20952130081
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[06:07] ehaas: anyone feel like testing out jquery in webshell?
[06:08] zomgbie has joined the channel
[06:08] JimBastard_: _̲͈͚̦̫͔̥͙̝͔͙̼͙͓̲͔͔̳͚̜͈̰͖̗̮̩̪͈̖̰̞͍͚̘̙̤̗̬̤̣͔͎̫̺̘̠̮͙̲͇̠̗͔͇̳̤̣͚͓̝̰̼̠̩͚̫̗̦̻͔͍͈̤̰̟͔͇̜̖̞͍̭͕̱̹̲̤̙̰̙̼͎̖͎̲̪̳̻̯̝̤̺̻͍͚̻͍̰̦̗̯̱͖̖̗̻̲̺̺̻͉̪̼̳̭͉͈̹̻̫̤̙̮̝̹͖͉ͅ
[06:08] ehaas: not familiar with that one
[06:09] micheil has joined the channel
[06:09] ehaas: i've got basic selectors working with jquery+libxmljs+env.js, was curious if anyone felt like testing it out
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[06:12] JimBastard_: ehaas: jsdom has a full working solution for jquery
[06:12] JimBastard_: we use it to parse websites
[06:12] JimBastard_: also, check it out, ive told twitter to fuck itself
[06:12] JimBastard_: http://twitter.com/maraksquires
[06:12] ehaas: oh nice
[06:12] ehaas: what does it use to parse
[06:12] JimBastard_: whatever is caked into jsdom, im not sure
[06:12] JimBastard_: kinda sleepy
[06:13] _announcer: Twitter: "nodejs building. The fast pace of development, much of the catch." [ja] -- Junya Ogura. http://twitter.com/junya/status/20952719955
[06:13] ehaas: ok cool
[06:13] ehaas: thanks
[06:15] _announcer: Twitter: "# Nodejs ͭ ̅ ͒ ̽ ͦ ͤ ͯ ̆ ͋ ͌ ͐ ͦ ̿̊ ͮ ͦ ͦ ͗ ͆ ̓̊̔ ͣ ͥ ̈̏̏ ͌ ͦ ̈ ͥ ̋ ͯ ͭ ͫ ͋ ̄̾ ͭ ̓̈̇ ͮ ͥ ̔ ͯ ̔̑ ͨ ͪ ̄ ͒ ͣ ͗ ̿ ͌ ̐ ͫ ͯ ͬ ̍̄̅̓̄̄ ͒ ̈ ͑ ̓ ͧ ͫ ͩ ͮ ̔ ͭ ͮ ̔ ͤ ͦ ̉̒ ͗ ̿ ͬ ̊ ͧ ̐ ͯ ͐ ͣ ͩ ̔ ͗ ͯ ͒ ͛ ͫ ͭ ͧ ̏̄ ͒ ͨ ͧ ͭ ̿̉ ͮ ͨ ͑ ̓ ͥ ̓̓" [lv] -- marak squires. http://twitter.com/maraksquires/status/20952851386
[06:16] jesusabdullah: What is all that text mess?
[06:16] jesusabdullah: Ah
[06:16] _announcer: Twitter: "# Nodejs ͈ ͚ ̦̫ ͔ ̥ ͙ ̝ ͔ ͙ ̼ ͙ ͓ ͔ ͔ ̳ ͚ ̜ ͈ ̰ ͖ ̗̮̩̪ ͈ ̖̰̞ ͍ ͚ ̘̙̤̗̬̤̣ ͔ ͎ ̫̺̘̠̮ ͙ ͇ ̠̗ ͔ ͇ ̳̤̣ ͚ ͓ ̝̰̼̠̩ ͚ ̫̗̦̻ ͔ ͍ ͈ ̤̰̟ ͔ ͇ ̜̖̞ ͍ ̭ ͕ ̹̤̙̰̙̼ ͎ ̖ ͎ ̪̳̻̯̝̤̺̻ ͍ ͚ ̻ ͍ ̰̦̗̯ ͖ ̖̗̻̺̺̻ ͉ ̪̼̳̭ ͉ ͈ ̹̻̫̤̙̮̝" [lv] -- marak squires. http://twitter.com/maraksquires/status/20952891062
[06:16] JimBastard_: AHAHAHAH
[06:16] JimBastard_: AHAHAHAH
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[06:16] JimBastard_: hahaha
[06:16] JimBastard_: fuck the internet
[06:18] ehaas: dude are you hacking
[06:19] JimBastard_: lol
[06:19] JimBastard_: http://twitter.com/maraksquires
[06:19] JimBastard_: ehaas: google groups is the best, http://groups.google.com/group/nycjs?pli=1
[06:19] JimBastard_: for sure
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[06:20] pkrumins: JimBastard_: va-va-wi-va i like!
[06:21] JimBastard_: :-)
[06:21] ehaas: it doesn't seem too bad to me
[06:21] ehaas: i dont see the stuff in that screencap
[06:21] JimBastard_: ehaas: try chrome
[06:21] JimBastard_: yeah, results may vary
[06:21] ehaas: i'm in chrome
[06:21] ehaas: os x
[06:21] JimBastard_: LOl me too
[06:21] ehaas: let me try safari
[06:21] JimBastard_: maybe you dont have enough language support
[06:21] jesusabdullah: Man I could use a font with more unicodes
[06:21] lachlanhardy has joined the channel
[06:21] ehaas: ya i'm american
[06:21] jesusabdullah: Like, my current font ain't bad, but
[06:21] ehaas: i only need 1 language
[06:21] dnolen has joined the channel
[06:21] JimBastard_: i think you need like 7 languages
[06:22] JimBastard_: ehaas: it works on my macbook
[06:22] jesusabdullah: seeing a LOT of boxes in that zalgo, JB
[06:22] JimBastard_: bought from apple store in nyc
[06:22] JimBastard_: maybe i installed something else
[06:22] ehaas: i basically only see it in the title bar
[06:22] JimBastard_: interesting
[06:22] JimBastard_: play with it a bit
[06:22] ehaas: and the subjec
[06:22] JimBastard_: http://github.com/marak/zalgo.js
[06:22] jesusabdullah: You want a screenie? Could tell you which ones aren't in bitstream vera sans mono
[06:23] ehaas: lol
[06:23] DraX: emacs 23 doesn't support the bidi stuff, though i have the right fonts for it :(
[06:23] ehaas: i just ran that program
[06:23] ehaas: worried i'm going to have nightmares
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[06:26] JimBastard_: ehaas: lulz
[06:26] JimBastard_: did it work on console?
[06:26] ehaas: yea
[06:26] JimBastard_: NICE
[06:26] JimBastard_: its really rough atm
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[06:26] JimBastard_: like barebones
[06:26] alcuadrado: is there any way to pass all recived arguments to another function? Let's say, the JS equivalent for this ruby code: http://www.pastie.org/1087678
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[06:26] ehaas: it looks like a medusa type monster with long dreds
[06:27] _announcer: Twitter: "#node.js ͈͚̦̫͔̥͙̝͔͙̼͙͓̲͔͔̳͚̜͈̰͖̗̮̩̪͈̖̰̞͍͚̘̙̤̗̬̤̣͔͎̫̺̘̠̮͙̲͇̠̗͔͇̳̤̣͚͓̝̰̼̠̩͚̫̗̦̻͔͍͈̤̰̟͔͇̜̖̞͍̭͕̱̹̲̤̙̰̙̼͎̖͎̲̪̳̻̯̝̤̺̻͍͚̻͍̰̦̗̯̱͖̖̗̻̲̺̺̻͉̪̼̳̭͉͈̹̻̫̤̙" -- marak squires. http://twitter.com/maraksquires/status/20953426806
[06:27] _announcer: Twitter: "#node.js ͭ̃̅͒̽ͦͤ̎ͯ̆́͋̂͌̀͐ͦ̿̊̀ͮͦͦ̎̀͗͆̓̊̔ͣͥ̈́̏̀̏͌ͦ̈ͥ̋ͯͭͫ͋̄̾ͭ̓̈̇ͮͥ̔ͯ̔̎͂̑ͨͪ̄͒ͣ͗̿͌̐ͫͯͬ̍̄̅̂̓̄̄͂͒̈͑̓ͧͫͩͮ̔ͭͮ̔ͤͦ̉̒͗̿͂́ͬ̊ͧ̐ͯ͐ͣͩ̔͗ͯ͒͛ͫͭͧ̏̄͒ͨͧͭ̿̉ͮ͂̂ͨ͑̓ͥ" -- marak squires. http://twitter.com/maraksquires/status/20953437344
[06:27] DraX: alcuadrado: other_function.apply(this, arguments)
[06:27] alcuadrado: but doesn't it pass them as a single array?
[06:27] JimBastard_: dammit _announcer 
[06:27] DraX: alcuadrado: no, apply will apply the arguments
[06:28] bentomas: can someone tell me the difference between the console global object and the sys module?
[06:28] bentomas: is console always going to be there?  and if so, why do we have most of the sys module...
[06:28] jesusabdullah: http://www.paulgraham.com/yahoo.html You guys saw this? I know there are a few (ex-)yahoo guys in here--what do they think?
[06:29] alcuadrado: DraX, thanks, I'll try that :)
[06:30] JimBastard_: paul gramham can piss off
[06:30] JimBastard_: with his stupid website that bans me
[06:31] tpryme: alcuadrado: Yeah, with apply
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[06:32] alcuadrado: tpryme, yeah, i didn't know about it's existence, and was using call()
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[06:32] DraX: you can .apply() call() :D
[06:35] alcuadrado: jajaja
[06:35] alcuadrado: I mena, hahaha
[06:37] jesusabdullah: alcuadrado: Do Spanish people typically type jajaja? Do you know?
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[06:38] alcuadrado: I'm from argentina hahaha
[06:38] jesusabdullah: http://jobs.github.com/positions/c97c8d2e-a04f-11df-8c60-be468719ed86 <_<
[06:38] alcuadrado: I always type jajajaja
[06:38] jesusabdullah: alcuadrado: Then you would know! At least, about Spanish speakers!
[06:38] jesusabdullah: Ah!
[06:38] jesusabdullah: Wonderful!
[06:38] jesusabdullah: I feel more multicultural already
[06:38] alcuadrado: hahah
[06:39] alcuadrado: what we never ever ever write is lol
[06:39] alcuadrado: and I almost hate that expresion :P
[06:40] jesusabdullah: Yeah
[06:41] jesusabdullah: I joined a channel once where a bot would harass you if you typed it
[06:41] jesusabdullah: Actually, the bot's still there
[06:41] jesusabdullah: we're just really well-trained now is all
[06:41] alcuadrado: great to here that, I thought every american used it
[06:42] tekky: jesusabdullah: if you think about it, J is an 'h' sound in Spanish.... 'hey-suse' vs Jesus, 'Ho-say' vs Jose
[06:42] jesusabdullah: Indeed
[06:43] tekky: I always see jejejeje vs jajajaja it seems
[06:43] jesusabdullah: In fact, my nick was originally intended to be pronounced as hay-seuss
[06:43] jesusabdullah: I just hadn't been able to confirm or deny the existence of intentional jajas and jejes
[06:44] jesusabdullah: Anyways: I'd better go to bed :(
[06:44] sveisvei has joined the channel
[06:44] tekky: me too
[06:45] tekky: finally get to start my orientation for new job tomorrow (paperwork part of it)
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[06:45] jesusabdullah: What job?
[06:45] jesusabdullah: :o
[06:45] tekky: be doing some javascript work at IBM
[06:45] alcuadrado: great man
[06:46] tekky: web based frontend for some hardware (dont have any details) - kinda like my old job, only better.... looking forward to new challenges
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[06:47] alcuadrado: did anyone said webOS? hehe
[06:47] alcuadrado: thay bought it, and it is said that their new tablets would have it
[06:47] shimondoodkin: why i have to do req.resume(); to receive port data? it worked before without it..?
[06:47] shimondoodkin: s/ port/post
[06:48] tekky: alcuadrado: heh, from the brief description it sounds more like an admin panel for some type of enterprise hardware not portable stuff :P
[06:48] alcuadrado: what a pitty
[06:48] alcuadrado: webOS looks great
[06:49] tekky: alcuadrado: nah, if it was webOS I probably wouldnt have got the job :P they were looking for people with lots of experience with Dojo and I imagine webOS based device wouldnt use that too much :P
[06:50] alcuadrado: yeah, you are right :P
[06:51] alcuadrado: I've never tryed dojo... I'm mostly a jQuery guy
[06:52] tekky: I would never have tried to use jQuery for my project at my old job -- it was hard enough bringing in updated versions of the Dojo src tree, couldnt imagine doing the same for jQuery + all the 3rd party mods it would have taken
[06:53] b_erb has joined the channel
[06:53] alcuadrado: yeah, that might be a problem
[06:53] alcuadrado: but most jQuery plugins are a piece of shit
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[06:53] alcuadrado: so you just ignore them hehe
[06:56] tekky: but when you are doing a single page application that has modals, trees, accordions, sliders, charts, interactive frontpanel display of a switches port lights, expanding textboxes and background uploads and I'm probably forgetting something :P you dont want to have to search the web for every little thing
[06:56] tekky: ohhh wizards for forms too...
[06:59] tekky: ugh /me wants my old gmail back... wheres the labs mod for that... hate the new "select unread" dropdown...
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[07:07] alcuadrado: yeah, that's true tekky
[07:08] CIA-77: node: 03Trent Mick 07master * r72e4a49 10/ lib/readline.js : repl completion: multi-column display of completions - http://bit.ly/9IaTga
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[07:09] tekky: ok really going to bed now that I've voiced my distaste for the new "Select" drodown in gmail
[07:10] tekky: gnite, ttyl alcuadrado
[07:10] alcuadrado: good night
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[07:14] _announcer: Twitter: "@andrewdotcom thanks for the links, node.js looks interesting and I was not aware of it all. Thinking about the Obj-C stuff." -- Ed Stivala. http://twitter.com/ed_private/status/20955760260
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[07:33] _announcer: Twitter: "how can i copy or move a file with #nodejs?" -- Sascha Depold. http://twitter.com/sdepold/status/20956649907
[07:34] _announcer: Twitter: "Hober @ alias js = &#39;= 1 NODE_NO_READLINE rlwrap node&#39;" [de] -- Ⓘⓢⓐⓐⓒ. http://twitter.com/izs/status/20956718774
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[07:36] jansc: Hi! Just wanted to let you know that there is a paper & presentation about server-side Topic Maps with nodejs at the Topic Maps Research and Applications 2010 conference. See http://tmra.de/2010/program
[07:37] jansc: See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Topic_Maps
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[07:50] Tim_Smart: ryah: ping
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[07:50] Tim_Smart: Ah wait, I think it is pretty late over there
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[08:00] SamuraiJack: someone please fix the REPL: http://github.com/ry/node/issues/#issue/171, http://github.com/ry/node/issues/#issue/232
[08:05] Tim_Smart: #171 works for me :/
[08:06] Tim_Smart: Also, you have to explicitly attach variables to the global object
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[08:22] _announcer: Twitter: "just pushed a little #nodejs tool to measure/display stdin lines-per-second http://github.com/mickm/lhz" -- wang. http://twitter.com/_wang/status/20958909515
[08:23] mscdex: node.js rules!
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[08:37] _announcer: Twitter: "fictivekin&#39;s webshell at master - GitHub: Node.js JavaScript client that runs an HTTP-based console interface http://bit.ly/9PpxZp wind" [ja] -- Inetgate Writer. http://twitter.com/Inetgate/status/20959563944
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[08:59] isaacs: it's working! http://github.com/mickm/lhz/blob/master/lhz#L3-9
[08:59] isaacs: hehe
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[09:13] alcuadrado: nice isaacs 
[09:13] isaacs: :)
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[09:32] Tim_Smart: isaacs: Is this the whole comma first thing?
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[09:37] isaacs: Tim_Smart: well, it's one example of it
[09:37] isaacs: Tim_Smart: in general, i put separators before the things they separate
[09:37] isaacs: and i don't use extra separators.
[09:39] _announcer: Twitter: "SXSWi 2011 &gt;&gt;Fast Funny Web Architecture with @OriPekelman & @ryah  VOTE HERE: http://bit.ly/sxsw11af  #sxsw #nodejs #nosql" -- Louis Montagne. http://twitter.com/xpoxpo/status/20962380048
[09:41] _announcer: Twitter: "A Node.js project: http://tumblr.com/xgqfkkt79" -- Paul Straw. http://twitter.com/paulstraw/status/20962476996
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[09:48] saikat: isaacs: you posted a good link a while back about how JS parses separators (maybe i saw it on the mailing list?).  Any chance you remember about it?
[09:49] isaacs: saikat: http://inimino.org/~inimino/blog/javascript_semicolons
[09:49] saikat: thanks
[09:54] Rv has joined the channel
[09:54] Rv: hi
[09:58] mape: hey
[10:04] eamonn has joined the channel
[10:04] eamonn: oo cool
[10:04] eamonn: glad to see there's lots of people in here
[10:05] stagas: ok I did a bugfix on a github repo how do I send it
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[10:10] _announcer: Twitter: "Interview with Ryan Dahl on node.js (Part 1): http://dailyjs.com/2010/08/10/ryan-dahl-interview/ #nodejs" -- Gideon de Kok. http://twitter.com/gideondk/status/20963830304
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[10:28] _announcer: Twitter: "watching "Data Throttling in Node.js" http://bit.ly/dldH0O #nodejs" -- Régis Gaidot. http://twitter.com/rgaidot/status/20964681086
[10:31] _announcer: Twitter: "I prepare a node.js tutorials on the roads, another should follow on CouchDB and # # nodejs ... Soon on http://www.it-wars.com:)" [fr] -- Vincent RABAH. http://twitter.com/itwars/status/20964813164
[10:32] _announcer: Twitter: "@CaptainRedmuff have a play with Node.js, and read Crockford's "JavaScript: The good parts" if you can. You will enjoy JavaScript again :-)" -- Tom Hudson. http://twitter.com/tomnomnom/status/20964852786
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[11:06] _announcer: Twitter: "Data Throttling in Node.js // WOOT ! http://flic.kr/p/8rCe9M" -- François-G. Ribreau. http://twitter.com/FGRibreau/status/20966501142
[11:07] _announcer: Twitter: "Lots of Haskell, Node.js and Android." -- Akash Manohar J. http://twitter.com/akashmanohar/status/20966553224
[11:10] _announcer: Twitter: "Coffeescript node.js cappuccino all incredibly funny toys. I do not even know have lost track of time by staying." [ko] -- deepblue. http://twitter.com/d6e/status/20966702624
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[11:28] _announcer: Twitter: ""How NodeJS saved my webapp" http://bit.ly/8Yo6cv #nodejs" -- Régis Gaidot. http://twitter.com/rgaidot/status/20967620981
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[11:34] _announcer: Twitter: "@sdepold fs.rename() will do it http://nodejs.org/api.html#fs-rename-104" -- Jerome Etienne. http://twitter.com/jerome_etienne/status/20967905167
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[11:52] FransWillem: Will this actually work: http://www.flickr.com/photos/geekfg/4884478049/ ? I figured if write returned false that you had to call it with the same data again later
[11:52] FransWillem: Ah, apparently sys.pump does that same, nvm
[11:52] mscdex: FransWillem: when write returns false, that just means it has used user memory to store whatever you wanted to write
[11:53] mscdex: FransWillem: because the kernel's send buffer was full
[11:53] FransWillem: Aaah, ok, but it is actually stored and will be sent at some point ?
[11:53] mscdex: yes, when the kernel send buffer has space
[11:53] mscdex: it's like a queue basically
[11:53] FransWillem: and drain means that both the kernel and user buffers are fully flushed ?
[11:54] mscdex: drain fires when no more user memory is being used
[11:54] FransWillem: Ah, so even if drain fires, the next write could still return false ?
[11:54] mscdex: possibly
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[11:55] mscdex: but maybe not, depending on the kernel send buffer
[11:55] FransWillem: Aaah, completely misunderstood that interface
[11:55] mscdex: by the time you do another write the kernel send buffer could have some space open
[11:55] FransWillem: I figured a write returning false meant "No more space in the kernel buffer, try again later", and drain meant "Kernel buffer is now empty, feel free to send more'
[11:55] mscdex: but then again, i think the default kernel buffer space is like 20kb or less
[11:56] mscdex: FransWillem: well, this is according to ryah in the video from yesterday's meetup
[11:56] FransWillem: But apparently write returning false means "Kernel buffer is full, we'll queue this for when it has space again, you probably want to prevent sending more data", and drain means "The queue was completely flushed to the kernel buffer, feel free to try and send more data now", right ?
[11:57] mscdex: yes
[11:57] FransWillem: Hmmm
[11:57] FransWillem: actually
[11:57] FransWillem: docs state this:
[11:57] mscdex: that's why you are more or less free to ignore what write returns, but if you care to deal with not using up a lot of user memory, then use the pause and resume mechanisms
[11:57] FransWillem: ' The 'drain' event will indicate when the kernel buffer is empty again. '
[11:57] FransWillem: Which would indicate that drain is being fired when both the queue and the kernel buffer are empty
[11:58] mscdex: i dunno... i'm just going on what ryah said yesterday
[11:58] mscdex: in his talk
[11:58] mscdex: have you watched it?
[11:58] FransWillem: Don't really watch the talks :/
[11:58] mscdex: oh
[11:59] FransWillem: Would love a transcript, though
[11:59] mscdex: heh, not sure there'll be one, but here's the link to the video fwiw: http://vimeo.com/14071325
[11:59] FransWillem: I can't really watch it at work, as it's not closely related to what I do (basically node.js is my slacking off time)
[11:59] mscdex: yeah
[11:59] mscdex: watch at home ;-)
[11:59] FransWillem: and at home I usually have enough other stuff that needs doing :p
[12:00] mscdex: it's just a tad under 27 minutes
[12:00] mscdex: a lot of it is people asking questions after the talk though
[12:01] mscdex: i think mjr is going to be posting the rest of the videos from the meetup sometime soon
[12:01] FransWillem: Might check it out later :)
[12:07] _announcer: Twitter: "How To Node http://goo.gl/fb/d9pJN #blogs #nodejs" -- Delicious Over 50. http://twitter.com/readelicious/status/20969780171
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[12:23] shockie: is it possible to mix http and https routes on a connect server instance? (eq / is non-secure, /secure is a stacked secure connect server)?
[12:24] shockie: when i try to do that, the protocol of the parent server (non-stacked) is used and the stacked server only listens to that protocol
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[12:30] mscdex: shockie: someone asked that the other day and i think creationix said that capability is on his todo list iirc
[12:30] shockie: ah, yeah i rememberd that conversation, didn't knew the outcome:)
[12:34] shockie: dutchies, fancy a node.js meetup?
[12:36] tg: hoi
[12:37] tg: yeah why not
[12:37] tg: i've just started looking into it
[12:38] shockie: ah nice:D
[12:39] shockie: i think my company can provide the beer and the place:D
[12:39] shockie: it's in rotterdam though:)
[12:39] tg: oic
[12:40] tg: i'm around ams though
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[12:41] shockie: an hour in the train isn't that bad;)
[12:41] tg: i've just found out this amsterdam.js group, maybe you could organize sth with them, not sure how active they are, but seems like they already had a couple of meetings
[12:41] tg: http://groups.google.com/group/amsterdam-js - here
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[12:45] shockie: ah, they focus on amsterdam though
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[12:48] tg: well, you can also come to am*dam :)
[12:49] eamonn: which framework do you guys think is better, geddy or jimi ?
[12:50] MrTopf: best to write your own ;-)
[12:51] eamonn: >:-|
[12:51] eamonn: lol
[12:52] MrTopf: well, there is actually some truth in it as sooner or later you are probably fighting whatever framework you've chosen. 
[12:52] MrTopf: of course it depends on how big the framework is.
[12:52] MrTopf: I like libraries more where you define the main control loop instead of it being imposed on you by the framework
[12:53] MrTopf: easier to exchange things then
[12:53] MrTopf: that's at least my experience with python but I guess it's similar with other tools
[12:54] stagas: scylla is a nice simple one
[12:54] MrTopf: (moreover I tend to do more and more stuff on the client so it's also good to have good client side components)
[12:54] eamonn: hmm lemme see scylla
[12:55] eamonn: yeah something simple would be nice just url routing, dunno
[12:55] eamonn: sort of new to this :o, checking it out 
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[12:59] stride: eamonn: there are quite a few that only do routing on the modules wiki page, though I love the simplicity of connect
[13:03] wattz: Good morning
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[13:04] caolanm: eamonn: I often just use connect plus the dispatch middleware
[13:05] caolanm: eamonn: http://github.com/caolan/dispatch, http://github.com/senchalabs/connect
[13:06] wattz: my little routing setup is regex based
[13:06] caolanm: eamonn: if you're looking for something more featureful, express is actively developed and based on connect too
[13:06] stride: looks nice, to this point the connect router middleware was sufficient for my needs though
[13:06] wattz: i find myself wanting something different than that's offered
[13:06] wattz: so i just roll my own
[13:08] wattz: yay, back to lex/yacc!
[13:08] wattz: well just lex (flex)
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[13:16] wattz: the question is Flex/Bison or Antlr
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[13:33] wattz: why does lexer/parser's always seem to elude me
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[13:36] FransWillem: wattz: This is the book they used at my Languages & Compilers course: http://www.cs.uu.nl/wiki/pub/TC/CourseMaterials/TC-20091110.pdf
[13:36] FransWillem: wattz: Heavily written towards Haskell, but should explain the concepts of lexers/parsers and how they work nicely
[13:36] wattz: oh i can do it
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[13:37] wattz: it's just an awkward way of thinking
[13:37] wattz: plus Antlr is much easier than lex/yacc
[13:37] wattz: but i appreciate the link, if antlr doesn't start behaving.... i will be forced to switch
[13:37] FransWillem: Yeah, lex and yacc are awful, but the whole concept isn't too difficult
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[13:42] wattz: my js grammer is compiling, yay!
[13:42] davidc_: FransWillem, awful isn't even close :)
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[13:51] _announcer: Twitter: "Listening to http://martiniinthemorning.com/, reading  up on the #nodejs list and multicasting some sweet datagrams." -- Rasmus Andersson. http://twitter.com/rsms/status/20976517572
[13:51] rsms: That was _fast_. Like <1 second fast.
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[13:55] wattz: i wrote my first parser with PCRE, seems a bit slow
[13:56] _announcer: Twitter: "@rsms Have you done anything with #nodejs yet? Are you participating in the Node Knockout?" -- Christopher Webb. http://twitter.com/conspirator/status/20976927566
[13:58] alexkwolfe has joined the channel
[13:58] _announcer: Twitter: "@conspirator Yeah, I'm kinda deep down in nodejs already :P Not participating in the Node KO though. Are you?" -- Rasmus Andersson. http://twitter.com/rsms/status/20977043006
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[13:58] _announcer: Twitter: "node.js windows binary: http://www.grati.org/?page_id=213" -- Junyi Sun. http://twitter.com/fxsjy/status/20977072787
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[13:59] _announcer: Twitter: "W3C's File API http://bit.ly/9cLa7L seems to have advanced, would it be a good abstraction for SSJS over the NodeJS FS (or others) API?" -- kriszyp. http://twitter.com/kriszyp/status/20977084799
[13:59] _announcer: Twitter: "@conspirator I wrote the server-side part of dropular.net entirely in Nodejs, BTW. Gotta love modern JS." -- Rasmus Andersson. http://twitter.com/rsms/status/20977124634
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[14:05] FransWillem: .
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[14:06] rsms: •
[14:08] jetienne: rsms: are you the one who wrote the p2p in spotify ?
[14:09] rsms: jetienne: nope. I designed the thing (UI, brand, etc). Ludvig Strigeus wrote the awesome magical p2p stuff.
[14:09] rsms: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludvig_Strigeus
[14:10] jetienne: oh lude :)
[14:10] rsms: jetienne: yeah, ludde is the most awesome low-level hacker I know
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[14:10] rsms: jetienne: guy can read memory dumps like they're books :P
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[14:10] jetienne: rsms: this is bt based ? or custom
[14:10] rwaldron: so... i have a non-node.js question that i think someone in here must know the answer to
[14:11] rwaldron: i'll gladly take it into a priv msg 
[14:11] rsms: rwaldron: throw it out here
[14:11] rwaldron: cool, thanks
[14:11] rwaldron: so, CouchDB?
[14:11] rwaldron: anyone have experience there?
[14:11] rwaldron: (i'm only asking because no one in #couchdb is talking)
[14:11] rsms: rwaldron: yeah, I run a site with a few thousand members which is based on CouchDB and Nodejs
[14:11] rwaldron: nm
[14:11] rsms: rwaldron: dropular.net ftr
[14:12] rwaldron: someone JUST now anserwed me
[14:12] rwaldron: rad
[14:12] rwaldron: i'll check it out
[14:12] rsms: rwaldron: sooo you're interested in using Node and couch?
[14:12] rwaldron: yes, i sure am
[14:13] rwaldron: i figured i'd mix my two latest obsessions
[14:13] rsms: rwaldron: the site is closed source and invite-only I'm afraid, but for instance http://dropular.net/#drops/interesting gets it's data from a couch view which is mapped with an algo weighting alot of different variables. Very experimental haha
[14:13] rsms: rwaldron: :)
[14:14] rwaldron: ill take a look in a moment
[14:14] rwaldron: thanks for the resource though!
[14:14] rsms: rwaldron: for the dropular project I wrote this light-weight nodejs module for interfacing with couchdb: http://github.com/rsms/node-couchdb-min
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[14:14] _announcer: Twitter: "Scale Stack vs node.js vs Twisted vs Eventlet http://oddments.org/?p=494 .. this ..." [zh-CN] -- litao cheng. http://twitter.com/litaocheng/status/20978265024
[14:15] rsms: rwaldron: here's a CRUD example for that module: http://groups.google.com/group/nodejs/msg/53dcc55b57fdf119
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[14:19] _announcer: Twitter: "http://devthought.com/blog/2009/12/accessing-a-mysql-database-from-nodejs/" -- Junyi Sun. http://twitter.com/fxsjy/status/20978615442
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[14:50] _announcer: Twitter: "who's participating in the node.js Knockout? http://nodeknockout.com" -- Adam Michela. http://twitter.com/soopa/status/20980926876
[14:51] _announcer: Twitter: "I still don't really understand Node.js #overmyhead" -- Andy Rossmeissl. http://twitter.com/rossmeissl/status/20981049976
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[15:00] Viriix: event listeners for eventEmmiters are stored in the objects _events var right?
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[15:03] mscdex: what's the best way to chain a variable series of child processes?
[15:03] mscdex: or is there no way? :S
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[15:03] siebertm: hi there! when try to load a x509 certificate via crypto.createCredentials, i get a "bad parameter" error about the key. key and cert data looks valid though (and apache accepts it) any ideas how i should debug that?
[15:04] _announcer: Twitter: "I halo, node.js website and download the version 8.4 release archive does not, ah, always fail decompression." [zh-CN] -- Sun Ning. http://twitter.com/Sunng/status/20981990262
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[15:04] SubStack: siebertm: is it a string and not a buffer?
[15:05] SubStack: if you're just doing fs.readFileSync('file') it's just a Buffer
[15:05] siebertm: erm... its what readFile returns... thanks!
[15:05] rwaldron has joined the channel
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[15:06] siebertm: SubStack: thank you! works like a charm (at least the server comes up...)
[15:07] x_or: Anyone here familiar with using connect?  I am using it to proxy to a rails app.  GET requests work great, but POST requests don't work.  I am wondering if there is something I am not doing in the connect proxy which will tell the request to send the end event.  
[15:07] x_or: When I run my app inside my own pure node.js harness, things work great.
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[15:13] SubStack: siebertm: yep, I had exactly the same problem a few weeks back ^_^
[15:13] siebertm: :)
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[15:19] bradleymeck: anyone know in node-irc how to check a person's flags, like voice or identified
[15:20] mscdex: ah nevermind, i figured out how to do it
[15:20] JimBastard: bradleymeck: naaah, but the #freenode people might help
[15:20] JimBastard: i think thats the chan
[15:21] bradleymeck: mmm it should be a mode set on a user, i just dont want to force a whois
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[15:27] _announcer: Twitter: "It sounds like a mashup model of &quot;Twitter Streaming API + node.js + Appcelerator Titanium = Real-time tweet map&quot; http://bit.ly/dax71W" [ja] -- moto. http://twitter.com/j3tm0t0/status/20983778924
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[15:33] Viriix: in the general consensus of Node.JS-dom, is it more appropriate to use Jade over HAML ?
[15:34] mscdex: node.js rules!
[15:34] bradleymeck: jade is being more developed
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[15:40] aurynn: jade?
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[15:42] jherdman: aurynn: sort of like haml -- see http://github.com/visionmedia/jade
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[15:43] aurynn: ah-hah.
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[15:44] aurynn: Oh, that's interesting
[15:44] bradleymeck: templates dont do well with streaming and it makes me a sad panda
[15:45] mscdex: a sad peter pan
[15:45] bradleymeck: you just want me in tights mscdex
[15:46] mscdex: no, but i do want your bot back
[15:46] _announcer: Twitter: "I &lt;3 #nodejs" -- Marc Harter. http://twitter.com/wavded/status/20985127879
[15:46] mscdex: i've missed countless opportunities to tweet back at someone
[15:46] bradleymeck: pfff i can bring him back on a at work basis
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[15:49] bradleymeck: dun dun dun, you got 6hrs
[15:53] JimBastard: ohh hi frankie
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[15:53] JimBastard: :p
[15:53] x_or: ryah:  I am debugging something using the connect library, and wondering if there is any special magic node does within http server differently between POST and GET requests?  I never see the "end" event in my handler, and I wonder if the connect guys forgot to send call something in their library.  It works for GET, so I am thinking perhaps GET requests (since they don't have a body, right?) would work without the call whereas POST requests would hang b
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[15:55] JimBastard: ͭ̃̅͒̽ͦͤ̎ͯ̆́͋̂͌̀͐ͦ̿̊̀ͮͦͦ̎̀͗͆̓̊̔ͣͥ̈́̏̀̏͌ͦ̈ͥ̋ͯͭͫ͋̄̾ͭ̓̈̇ͮͥ̔ͯ̔̎͂̑ͨͪ̄͒ͣ͗̿͌̐ͫͯͬ̍̄̅̂̓̄̄͂͒̈͑̓ͧͫͩͮ̔ͭͮ̔ͤͦ̉̒͗̿͂́ͬ̊ͧ̐ͯ͐ͣͩ̔͗ͯ͒͛ͫͭͧ̏̄͒ͨͧͭ̿̉ͮ͂̂ͨ͑̓ͥ̓̓
[15:55] JimBastard: ͈͚̦̫͔̥͙̝͔͙̼͙͓̲͔͔̳͚̜͈̰͖̗̮̩̪͈̖̰̞͍͚̘̙̤̗̬̤̣͔͎̫̺̘̠̮͙̲͇̠̗͔͇̳̤̣͚͓̝̰̼̠̩͚̫̗̦̻͔͍͈̤̰̟͔͇̜̖̞͍̭͕̱̹̲̤̙̰̙̼͎̖͎̲̪̳̻̯̝̤̺̻͍͚̻͍̰̦̗̯̱͖̖̗̻̲̺̺̻͉̪̼̳̭͉͈̹̻̫̤̙̮̝
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[15:55] JimBastard: 
ACTION achoooo!

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[15:56] _announcer: Twitter: "node.js I should think more highly parallel processing to capture even Greenthread" [ja] -- こば@変人生徒会長. http://twitter.com/KOBA789/status/20985914820
[15:56] aurynn: It's a unicode explosion all over my display.
[15:57] aubergine has joined the channel
[15:57] JimBastard: !tweet @KOBA789 ͭ̃̅͒̽ͦͤ̎ͯ̆́͋̂͌̀͐ͦ̿̊̀ͮͦͦ̎̀͗͆̓̊̔ͣͥ̈́̏̀̏͌ͦ̈ͥ̋ͯͭͫ͋̄̾ͭ̓̈̇ͮͥ̔ͯ̔̎͂̑ͨͪ̄͒ͣ͗̿͌̐ͫͯͬ̍̄̅̂̓̄̄͂͒̈͑̓ͧͫͩͮ̔ͭͮ̔ͤͦ̉̒͗̿͂́ͬ̊ͧ̐ͯ͐ͣͩ̔͗ͯ͒͛ͫͭͧ̏̄͒ͨͧͭ̿̉ͮ͂̂ͨ͑̓ͥ̓̓
[15:58] JimBastard: i wonder how frankie handles that
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[15:58] aurynn: dear JimBastard, please stop doing that.
[15:58] JimBastard: aurynn: okay okay, sorry
[15:58] JimBastard: this is why i cant have nice things :-(
[15:58] JimBastard: ill stop for the day
[15:58] qschzt: x_or i do get end events for both just fine
[15:59] x_or: JimBastard:  Funny, I thought my Adium client was borked, was trying to change fonts and see if I could fix it. But, I guess that was intentionally weird looking.
[15:59] aubergine: Hi... are there any readStream/writeStream guru's around that could cast an eye over 10 lines of code ?
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[16:00] x_or: qschzt:  OK, good to know.  Have you built a handler for Server.use()?  In your handler do you call request.end()?  Or, it comes in naturally?  Do you call next().  The docs are a bit sparse for me, trying to figure out what is proper behavior.
[16:00] JimBastard: x_or: you cant escape zalg
[16:00] JimBastard: o
[16:00] JimBastard: ooooo
[16:00] JimBastard: http://github.com/marak/zalgo.js
[16:02] x_or: qschzt:  I must be doing something to block the "end" event from firiing.
[16:02] aniero: what is this unicode madness
[16:02] JimBastard: x_or: are you introducing application logic in your http.Server?
[16:02] JimBastard: errr, application latency
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[16:03] qschzt: x_or no Server.use(), i actually run everything through an intermediate handler that calls the right handler when request.end().. i don't call next()
[16:03] aubergine: I'm trying to createReadStream on a file that doesn't exist. It throws an error... which is fine, but node barfs and exits and the error doesn't make it back to the catch block
[16:03] aubergine: http://pastie.org/1088546
[16:04] bradleymeck: note to self, have a disable diacritics
[16:04] x_or: JimBastard:  What do you mean by that?  Am I calling something which has delays such that asynchronous requests later might get handled first?
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[16:04] bradleymeck: invert that, are you doing something that blocks for long enough to cause requests to be skipped
[16:05] JimBastard: x_or: something like http://github.com/nodejitsu/node-http-proxy/blob/master/demo.js#L55
[16:05] JimBastard: that will break in normal http.Server
[16:05] x_or: Hmm, when I get a request, I then send the request off to a proxy underneath.  This obviously takes longer than a moment, so perhaps this is what you mean?
[16:05] JimBastard: not sure if thats your issue, im just guessing
[16:05] JimBastard: yeah dude
[16:05] JimBastard: you should use our proxy server
[16:06] JimBastard: http://github.com/nodejitsu/node-http-proxy
[16:06] bradleymeck: and aubergine, you need to check if file exists first, otherwise the io part of the event loop will barf outside of your code
[16:06] JimBastard: you have to buffer your events
[16:06] x_or: JimBastard:  will this proxy work for people that hate rainbows?  
[16:06] JimBastard: x_or: no
[16:07] x_or: Yes, that sounds like the issue.
[16:07] JimBastard: sorry
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[16:07] JimBastard: x_or: check out the section in help titled "How to proxy requests with a regular http server"
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[16:07] JimBastard: i think that might help you
[16:07] x_or: This is great help, thanks so much.
[16:07] JimBastard: :-)
[16:07] JimBastard: if you use the third implementation, make sure you  var proxy = new httpProxy.HttpProxy;     proxy.watch(req, res); first
[16:07] x_or: JimBastard:  I'm beginning to think you are not such a bastard, despite the name.  You've helped me considerably many times now.
[16:08] JimBastard: before anything else
[16:08] JimBastard: x_or: hee hee
[16:08] JimBastard: nodejitsu is company too ;-)
[16:08] JimBastard: also, i am http://github.com/marak
[16:08] JimBastard: nodejitsu is MY* company
[16:08] JimBastard: oops
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[16:08] aubergine: bradleymeck: but if the stat to check it exists is async... and in between the stat to check the file exists and actually opening the stream, something else delete the file... I'm back wherre I started ? no ?
[16:09] bradleymeck: yup, which is always true if you are doing non-blocking
[16:09] aubergine: 
ACTION nods

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[16:10] bradleymeck: there might be a sync thing /digs
[16:10] ryah: x_or: you should get an "end" event for GET
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[16:10] JimBastard: ryah: i think he was having a proxy problem
[16:10] x_or: Yes, definitely.  Thanks ryah.
[16:11] aubergine: so the rationale was... this is gonna happen now and again.... log it and carry on (which I can tolerate in the actual use case (a relaxed filesystem cloner)
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[16:14] bradleymeck: mmmm, is there a decent way to return a function from a new context ala Script.runInNewContext?
[16:16] caolanm: pass in an exports object? so that it can modify that in your original scope?
[16:16] caolanm: hmm not sure that's what you meant ;)
[16:17] aubergine: ... what's puzzling me is not that there's an error, but that it doesn't make it back to the catch block.
[16:17] aubergine: Could be my lack of javascript foo, or a feature of node/v8/some other lib
[16:18] mjr_: rsms: are you doing multicast in node?
[16:19] JimBastard: javscript-fu
[16:19] JimBastard: ?
[16:19] aubergine: 
ACTION has at least three different things I'd like to do with node and multicast :-D

[16:20] nerdEd_ has joined the channel
[16:20] mjr_: We'll need at least a couple more socket options exposed in the binding to make it useful, I think.
[16:20] aubergine: and would _love_ the right hooks to underlying stuff exposed in node
[16:20] Egbert9e9: is there an object similar to 'window' in node.js?
[16:20] mjr_: It's almost there though.  If you want to look, check out how setTTL works.
[16:21] mjr_: Egbert9e9: do you want the global object, or do you want the special stuff that node has object?
[16:22] Egbert9e9: global object
[16:22] Egbert9e9: (what're the special stuff?)
[16:22] mjr_: special stuff is process
[16:22] mjr_: global is global
[16:22] aubergine: JimBastard: javascript[fu|foo]... I always doubt my own programming skills
[16:23] ryah: Egbert9e9: process.version
[16:23] mape: I threw together a proof of concept page for a node monitoring(dtrace/memory/cpu) app, http://node-monitoring.mape.me/ any thoughts?
[16:23] JimBastard: http://github.com/marak/javascript-fu
[16:23] JimBastard: unreleased :-(
[16:23] _announcer: Twitter: "Checked the limestone with the latest Sphinx and Node.js, like running. All right. Now would be a further buffers translate it, it would be even great" [ru] -- Serge Shirokov. http://twitter.com/kurokikaze/status/20987918272
[16:23] ryah: the tab completion stuff is so great
[16:23] mjr_: mape: that's awesome
[16:23] mape: it is a bit on the heavy side now but yeah, could be scaled down pretty easily
[16:24] ryah: mape: wow
[16:24] ryah: mape: you're going to make me look bad
[16:24] mjr_: are you going to add column sorting?
[16:24] Egbert9e9: ryah: v0.1.103
[16:24] mape: ryah: Not if you get dtrace running :P
[16:25] mape: mjr_: yeah, just candy kinda proof of concept now
[16:25] mape: Wasen't sure if anything important was missing so waited with the client logic
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[16:25] mjr_: ryah: I'm so loving tab completion.  If it just had word back/forward, I'd almost not even notice that it wasn't real readline.
[16:25] mape: But so yeah, is there anything missing?
[16:26] mjr_: mape: hard to say without putting real data through there and trying to solve an actual problem
[16:26] mape: Yeah
[16:26] qschzt: mape, network i/o / throughput?
[16:26] qschzt: :)
[16:26] mjr_: Can I re-use this for a network monitor?
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[16:27] mape: I guess, are you going to make millions of dollars selling the network monitor? ;)
[16:27] mjr_: Uhh, no.  I'd predict roughly US$0
[16:28] mape: The scrollbar is borrowed from Dions bespin/webkit scrollbar post though
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[16:28] mape: Should probly redo it so there are no license issues
[16:28] mape: But yeah sure, if you wanna use it feel free
[16:28] mjr_: I want to plug my realtime network data into something visually pleasing
[16:28] mjr_: Right now I have that stupid thing:
[16:28] mjr_: http://db.ranney.com:81/
[16:28] mape: broke
[16:28] mjr_: oh, hilariously just crashed
[16:29] mjr_: oh, somebody sent me a head, and I didn't check the method
[16:29] mjr_: MUST NOT have a body
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[16:30] ryah: hm
[16:30] ryah: that should be a warning...
[16:30] mjr_: mape: anyway, instead of functions, I want to put network connections
[16:31] qschzt: mape, the totals don't update?
[16:31] mjr_: And have it all update live
[16:31] mape: qschzt: it is just a dumb proof of concept
[16:31] mjr_: ryah: also, I should check the method.  I just threw that thing together quickly.
[16:31] qschzt: mape righto
[16:32] qschzt: mape, could be cool to have 1, 5, 15 min and daily weekly yearly views ;-)
[16:33] mjr_: I guess I should get some sort of IRC proxy so I don't keep logging out when I switch computers.
[16:33] mape: hmm guess you could do 3 graphs for the cpu, but sure if that makes it to thin though
[16:33] aubergine: qschzt: I went down this route a couple of weeks ago with application counters.... you end up re-inventing rrdtool really quickly :-)
[16:34] qschzt: aubergine yeah :)
[16:34] aubergine: and that's quite a well tried and tested wheel
[16:35] qschzt: having had this open for a few minutes now, a min/avg/median/max could be useful here
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[16:37] _announcer: Twitter: "cool node.js monitoring app using Smoothie Chart (html 5 canvas element) http://bit.ly/akHIca" -- Brian Mavity. http://twitter.com/bmavity/status/20988920825
[16:37] mape: on the graphs?
[16:38] qschzt: yeah
[16:38] mape: well you do have min and maxa
[16:38] mape: *max
[16:38] mape: avg could be added yeah
[16:38] qschzt: like a red line
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[16:41] thehin: hello, im following these instructions: http://wiki.github.com/ry/node/building-node-on-windowscygwin
[16:42] thehin: fresh install of cygwin with mentioned packages installed
[16:42] thehin: i get the fatal error – unable to remap message but i do have cygwin installed in C:\cygwin
[16:42] thehin: so im not sure whats going on here, i also tried to rebaseall
[16:43] x_or: JimBastard:  I am trying to get the http-proxy to work with a rails app, but still getting nothing when I do it with POST requests.  I tried it with a very slim set of files, does anything here look strange to you?  http://gist.github.com/521254, http://gist.github.com/521257, http://gist.github.com/521259.  Basically I am using a handler to set a special header, then sending into my rails app.  Does anything look weird to you?
[16:43] matt_c: That finger protocol implementation in node yesterday was addictive.  Today's activity is a twitter proxy via finger: http://gist.github.com/519344#file_twitter_finger.js
[16:44] JimBastard: x_or: gimme a minute
[16:45] JimBastard: x_or: so , you are using connect right
[16:45] x_or: JimBastard:  Yeah, the app works with GET requests fine.  But, POST requests never get through.
[16:46] x_or: Have you used http-proxy with rails app?  I cannot figure out why this would not work.
[16:46] JimBastard: x_or: its possible the proxy is broken for posts, but i doubt it
[16:46] JimBastard: still reading your code
[16:46] JimBastard: let me do a simple test here
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[16:47] x_or: OK, I have to step out for a minute, back in a short while.    I will check in a little while and respond to any questions you have from me.  Thanks for your help.
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[16:51] _announcer: Twitter: "node.js: Node's goal is to provide an easy way to build scalable network programs. In the &.. http://nodejs.org/#about [vía delicious]" -- Felipe Lavín. http://twitter.com/felipelavinz/status/20989901790
[16:52] _announcer: Twitter: "@wavded can i use nodejs to server common apps or it ideal for services? #n00b" -- Jason Mulligan. http://twitter.com/jasonmulligan/status/20989961238
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[16:55] JimBastard: so x_or i did some sanity checks over here with a vanilla http-proxy, posts work fine
[16:55] JimBastard: gonna check your code again
[16:56] JimBastard: x_or: i bet you its something fucked up with how connect handles requests
[16:56] JimBastard: tj / tim aren't online right now
[16:56] gf3: NO U
[16:56] JimBastard: its possible they are doing some processing to the request before it hits the proxy handler
[16:56] JimBastard: or something
[16:57] JimBastard: stfu gf3 
[16:57] gf3: NO NO U
[16:57] nefD: gf3 is right.. u
[16:57] JimBastard: gf3: im still upset about not being able to troll you in #jquery-ot
[16:58] JimBastard: fuck paul-english
[16:58] mAritz: i get all kinds of errors from npm. (can't unpack some tgzs but others are fine, can't delete the /usr/local/lib/node/.npm/.tpm/somethingsomething folder and more :( )  can someone here shed a light on this?
[16:58] gf3: JimBastard: you could make an appeal to someone
[16:58] JimBastard: gf3: eeeeeeeeeeeh
[16:58] JimBastard: mAritz: are you up to date?
[16:58] mAritz: git pull says so
[16:58] JimBastard: mAritz: i saw a notice from isaacs that there was an updgrade issue maybe
[16:58] JimBastard: delete and reinstall?
[16:58] mAritz: tried that
[16:58] mAritz: :/
[16:59] JimBastard: brb, sorry
[16:59] JimBastard: isaacs will help ya
[16:59] mAritz: yeah, when he's here.
[17:00] mAritz: hm... i just checked out v0.1.25 installed it apparently installed 0.1.23 oO
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[17:04] mAritz: maybe installing > node@v0.1.102 will help xD
[17:05] JimBastard: aye
[17:08] onar: is nodejs-autorestart the recommended way to have node.js auto-restart when files have changed during development?
[17:08] persson has joined the channel
[17:08] onar: or is there something built in (like a node flag?) now
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[17:11] CIA-77: node: 03Ryan Dahl 07master * r9acd76e 10/ lib/http.js : Don't throw on HEAD requests - http://bit.ly/bIAxhC
[17:11] CIA-77: node: 03Ryan Dahl 07master * r083ee0f 10/ (71 files in 12 dirs): Upgrade V8 to 2.3.7 - http://bit.ly/9VSi1E
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[17:13] mjr_: This is bad, 2 V8 minor releases in a row that didn't improve performance on all platforms.
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[17:13] mjr_: They are slipping.
[17:13] mape: :/
[17:13] mape: waiting for IE9 to drop so they can speed ahead again?
[17:14] mjr_: Right, sandbagging their performance tricks.
[17:14] blowery: they just have a goFaster loop somewhere that they're reducing the upper bound on 
[17:14] mape: hehe
[17:15] mjr_: Oh, look what I found in the sofa cushions!  It's a comprehensive set of new JavaScript technology that I had forgotten all about.
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[17:15] Egbert9e9: yes, i don't really understand what i'm doing. trying to read /dev/urandom and write that into /dev/audio http://pastebin.com/96y2YFFa
[17:15] JimBastard: onar: node-autorestart scares me
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[17:16] JimBastard: Egbert9e9: welcome to async programming
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[17:16] Egbert9e9: oh
[17:16] Egbert9e9: so it didn't read from urandom but still trying to write to audio?
[17:17] Egbert9e9: okay, i get it
[17:17] JimBastard: Egbert9e9: http://debuggable.com/posts/understanding-node-js:4bd98440-45e4-4a9a-8ef7-0f7ecbdd56cb is a good explanation
[17:17] onar: JimBastard: yeah. I still think it's convoluted for what is a very common workflow
[17:17] alcuadrado: Hi, is there any cross-browser way to get only the real argumetns of a function as an array? As in V8 arguments is an object containing not only that, also calee and more stuff
[17:17] JimBastard: there is no guarantee to the order those complete
[17:17] JimBastard: onar: restarting the app?
[17:18] JimBastard: alcuadrado: yeah
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[17:18] _announcer: Twitter: "Seriously, if NodeJS/Ruby fibers seem neat to you, head over to http://bit.ly/dCqcnQ to get your mind blown." -- Carrie . http://twitter.com/carrie_lee87/status/20991790376
[17:18] alcuadrado: and how can I manage to do that?
[17:18] onar: JimBastard: yeah, isn't this what we have fsevents (or similar) for :D
[17:19] JimBastard: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1507085/explaining-some-of-john-resigs-ninja-code
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[17:19] ehaas: JimBastard: zalgo did weird things to my spotlight
[17:19] JimBastard: onar: i dont really understand why people love hot reloading so much
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[17:20] JimBastard: onar: our general app approach here is to build crash only systems
[17:20] onar: JimBastard: depends on the change, but since any dynamic language (of significance) works that way, your expectation is that node will as well
[17:21] JimBastard: onar: if you change a <script> tag on the page in the browser, does the page reload?
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[17:21] JimBastard: ehaas: zalgo is evil
[17:21] ehaas: he's a real asshole
[17:22] ehaas: is it a he? do demons have gender?
[17:22] JimBastard: he came to me in a dream last night
[17:22] JimBastard: he told me to write more javascripts
[17:22] JimBastard: obey_̲͈͚̦̫͔̥͙̝͔͙̼͙͓̲͔͔̳͚̜͈̰͖̗̮̩̪͈̖̰̞͍͚̘̙̤̗̬̤̣͔͎̫̺̘̠̮͙̲͇̠̗͔͇̳̤̣͚͓̝̰̼̠̩͚̫̗̦̻͔͍͈̤̰̟͔͇̜̖̞͍̭͕̱̹̲̤̙̰̙̼͎̖͎̲̪̳̻̯̝̤̺̻͍͚̻͍̰̦̗̯̱͖̖̗̻̲̺̺̻͉̪̼̳̭͉͈̹̻̫̤̙̮̝̹͖͉ͅ
[17:22] JimBastard: zalgo ͭ̃̅͒̽ͦͤ̎ͯ̆́͋̂͌̀͐ͦ̿̊̀ͮͦͦ̎̀͗͆̓̊̔ͣͥ̈́̏̀̏͌ͦ̈ͥ̋ͯͭͫ͋̄̾ͭ̓̈̇ͮͥ̔ͯ̔̎͂̑ͨͪ̄͒ͣ͗̿͌̐ͫͯͬ̍̄̅̂̓̄̄͂͒̈͑̓ͧͫͩͮ̔ͭͮ̔ͤͦ̉̒͗̿͂́ͬ̊ͧ̐ͯ͐ͣͩ̔͗ͯ͒͛ͫͭͧ̏̄͒ͨͧͭ̿̉ͮ͂̂ͨ͑̓ͥ̓̓
[17:23] JimBastard: fuck i promised i wouldnt do it again
[17:23] JimBastard: dammit
[17:23] alcuadrado: Thanks JimBastard 
[17:23] JimBastard: sorry alcuadrado :-(
[17:23] JimBastard: ohhh ahaha nm
[17:23] JimBastard: that was a real thanks
[17:23] JimBastard: i thought you were the guy from before 
[17:23] JimBastard: >.<
[17:23] mAritz: JimBastard: you just totally fucked up my irc clients rendering :D
[17:24] Egbert9e9: zalgo O_O
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[17:25] JimBastard: mAritz: thats nothing, have you not seen the other links?
[17:25] alcuadrado: JimBastard, haha, no, in deed, thanks =)
[17:25] JimBastard: http://github.com/marak/zalgo.js
[17:25] JimBastard: http://groups.google.com/group/nycjs
[17:25] JimBastard: http://twitter.com/maraksquires
[17:25] JimBastard: no one is immune to the effects of ZALLLGOOOOO
[17:25] JimBastard: mAritz: ^^
[17:26] devinus: off topic question, anybody know how to get clang to compile C++ files too?
[17:26] mAritz: http://i.imgur.com/RMMMl.png
[17:26] JimBastard: ohh mAritz thats not even right
[17:27] mjr_: devinus: I think the latest, most bleeding-edge version of clang does C++, no?
[17:27] JimBastard: mAritz: you are only seeing the slight fuck up, there is a much worse one
[17:27] mAritz: :D
[17:27] devinus: mjr_: ah, you're right
[17:27] ryah: devinus: yes
[17:27] JimBastard: taking ss
[17:27] ryah: v8 however does not compile out of the box
[17:27] devinus: ryah: you knew what i was doing :P
[17:27] ryah: but it's easy to fix
[17:27] JimBastard: mAritz: http://imgur.com/WWXEk.png
[17:27] ryah: devinus: you need to build clang from svn
[17:27] JimBastard: try a webkit browser if you have one
[17:28] JimBastard: could be your os though
[17:28] devinus: ryah: i may look into that tonight
[17:28] ryah: devinus: are you using that?
[17:28] ryah: the released ones dont work, i think
[17:28] devinus: ryah: not yet, but now i will be
[17:28] mAritz: JimBastard: you glorious bastard :D
[17:28] ryah: devinus: compiling llvm is pretty annoying - but if you follow the instructions on the page it works out
[17:28] ryah: you have to like, edit source files and shit
[17:28] devinus: ryah: as long as you don't keep stealing my development ideas! then i may be able to check that out
[17:29] JimBastard: it looks amazing on the iphone
[17:29] JimBastard: https://mail.google.com/mail/?ui=2&ik=dbf6901d61&view=att&th=12a67566cf57f393&attid=0.1&disp=inline&zw
[17:29] mAritz: so, what's going on with connect? there's a tag for 0.2.3 but no history entry above 0.2.1 except one for 1.0.0 of which no tag exists yet. what am i supposed to use? :D
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[17:29] ryah: devinus: just do "CC=clang CXX=clang scons"
[17:29] ryah: devinus: to compile it
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[17:30] ryah: not involve node yet
[17:30] _announcer: Twitter: "Let the numbers speak for themselves: a SproutCore build takes 1m26s with Abbot (Ruby) and 0.5s with Garçon (Node.js) on my MBP Core i7 :D" -- Martin Ottenwaelter. http://twitter.com/martoche/status/20992551234
[17:30] devinus: ryah: yeah that's what i tried before i realized that the clang shipping with snow leopard is too old
[17:30] ryah: i think we have a problem of exporting CC and CXX to the scons subprocess
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[17:30] Egbert9e9: shouldn't this work, then? http://pastebin.com/y8VNz5Eg
[17:30] devinus: ryah: nope, it works
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[17:31] devinus: exporting to the scons subprocess that is
[17:31] ryah: devinus: oh okay
[17:32] EyePulp: is there a good idiom for answering a jsonp request?  I've got a server that returns request.simpleJSON(foo); but want to respond with jsonp formatted json, and wasn't sure if there was a builtin technique -- apologies in advance for my sketchy handle on how this works.
[17:33] JimBastard: EyePulp: its really easy
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[17:33] JimBastard: EyePulp: dunno if this is what you are asking, but you just have a url query string parameter called "callback"
[17:33] JimBastard: and you wrap the response with a method with the name being whatever "callback" is
[17:34] EyePulp: JimBastard: got that - using jquery to handle the request
[17:34] JimBastard: so whats the question?
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[17:34] devinus: ryah: i believe llvm 2.8 has all the C++ support included
[17:35] EyePulp: JimBastard: I was wondering if there's a convenience method that checks for the presence of callback automatically and if present returns jsonp, if not returns json
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[17:35] JimBastard: EyePulp: its just a query string param
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[17:35] JimBastard: check if it exists, if not then it dont
[17:35] JimBastard: should only be a couple lines o code
[17:36] JimBastard: i should make jsonp middleware maybe
[17:36] EyePulp: JimBastard: fair enough - again, I'm slow on the uptake. =)  I didn't realize the output side was so basic (today's the first time I looked at jsonp)
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[17:36] JimBastard: EyePulp: its cool man
[17:36] JimBastard: EyePulp: jsonp is crazy simple once you understand how it works
[17:37] devinus: ah 2.8 is not released yet
[17:37] devinus: got it
[17:37] FransWillem: eeek, got some haskell like lazy evaluation working in JS :p
[17:38] EyePulp: JimBastard: actually, middleware seems to make a lot more sense - this server I'm hacking on has tons of response.simpleJSON calls - a middleware could detect and wrap all of those responses properly, no?  
[17:39] alcuadrado: Hey guys, how do you write auto-invoking functions, (function () {})() or (function () {}()). I thought the first was more used, but JSLint is telling me to use the second
[17:39] _announcer: Twitter: "interesting async vs threads debate, talking about tradeoffs of each sides and the hype of #nodejs http://is.gd/eci5S" -- Florent Monbillard. http://twitter.com/fmonbillard/status/20993129625
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[17:40] mjr_: ryah: I think we could use some direction from above on the documentation situation.  api.html is huge and growing all the time, and we haven't even documented everything yet.
[17:40] mjr_: Lots of people are complaining that it's hard to read, doesn't work on their mobile device, etc.
[17:41] mu-hannibal: I've seen some talk about binding to interfaces (both server and client code) in the IRC logs before (creationix) - does someone already have that working?
[17:42] mu-hannibal: looks like it should be a small patch - just adding another parameter to bind and setting the socket option...
[17:42] mjr_: I forgot who needed that and how they eventually solved it.
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[17:42] _announcer: Twitter: "@rossmeissl If you understand how to do event handling in a browser, you know how to use node.js." -- Thijs van der Vossen. http://twitter.com/thijs/status/20993358112
[17:43] bradleymeck: i use the first alcuadrado, then again i ignore jslint like 90% the time
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[17:44] alcuadrado: I prefer the first too, but maybe I was the only one:P
[17:44] mjr_: alcuadrado: I just do what JSLint tells me to, except I use bitwise operators a lot.
[17:44] creationix: mu-hannibal: I just have multiple ips, I can't bind to a specific interface
[17:46] _announcer: Twitter: "Multithreaded is better than NodeJS if you love Ruby and hate JS. http://j.mp/9THdI4  But why would I write ruby when you can write js?" -- Ⓘⓢⓐⓐⓒ. http://twitter.com/izs/status/20993596377
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[17:46] mu-hannibal: creationix: I see - in that case I will look into adding support for that - any suggestions for how the network interface should be specified in the javascript API?
[17:46] bradleymeck: better is relative to knowing semaphore locking vs evented
[17:47] bradleymeck: mu-hannibal as close to a well used api as you can is generally what i find, but still dock all the function signatures / in / out expectations
[17:48] mu-hannibal: k - will try my best :)
[17:48] bradleymeck: s/dock/doc
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[17:53] _announcer: Twitter: "New blog post: How condescending can you be about Node.js? http://orangutancloud.com/how-condescending-can-you-be-about-node-js/" -- Orangutan Cloud. http://twitter.com/orangutancloud/status/20994036436
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[17:54] mjr_: mu-hannibal: I dunno, maybe a third argument to net.createConnection() ?
[17:54] mjr_: Then also tie in bind() right before connect()?
[17:55] mu-hannibal: mjr_: sounds good 
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[17:58] EyePulp: is there a command similar to python's dir() to do some introspection or listing of an object's methods?
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[18:00] bradleymeck: Object.keys(o) gives you all the properties
[18:01] EyePulp: cool
[18:01] EyePulp: thanks
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[18:01] bradleymeck: Object.keys(o).filter(function(p){return typeof o[p]=="function"}) gives you methods
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[18:03] JimBastard: so the old mantra use to be "rails doesnt scale", is the new one "node.js is overhyped" ?
[18:04] bradleymeck: rails is rocking, dont come a knocking i think fits the attitude better...
[18:04] nefD: with all the attention its been getting, node is the shiny new target :P
[18:05] isaacs: JimBastard: when the strongest criticism one can make of your program is "it's too popular", that's pretty badass.
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[18:05] JimBastard: thats what im saying isaacs 
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[18:05] bradleymeck: it doesnt follow continuation style! I have to separate logical chunks QQ
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[18:06] creationix: threads are better because my language has threads!
[18:06] creationix: and my language is better because it has threads
[18:06] JimBastard: im not smart enough to manage threads :-(
[18:07] _announcer: Twitter: ""I'm not a prof. coder, but a translator" (later) "I'm a monoglot" "Doesn't that affect your job?" @jedschmidt on (fab) at #nodejs" -- Ⓘⓢⓐⓐⓒ. http://twitter.com/izs/status/20994909885
[18:07] creationix: lol
[18:07] bradleymeck: i hate semaphors, hate is too light a word...
[18:08] JimBastard: i implemented "multithreading" in coldfusion before they had the http://livedocs.adobe.com/coldfusion/8/htmldocs/help.html?content=Tags_t_04.html tag
[18:08] JimBastard: that shit was not fun
[18:08] creationix: If we all jumped on es-discuss and started lobbying for js features (or removal of features) that made node more awesome, think it would make a difference
[18:08] JimBastard: creationix: lobby who?
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[18:08] creationix: of course, we first have to decide what's best
[18:08] bradleymeck: wait where? i complain to ppl on the mailinglist, no one listens
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[18:09] mAritz: isaacs: hey, i'm trying to install github.com/evilstreak/markdown-js  with npm. when it's installed and i do require('markdown-js') it just returns {}. is that a problem of markdown-js or npm or me?
[18:10] isaacs: mAritz: it's a markdown-js problem.
[18:10] isaacs: it doesn't name a main module, so npm doesn't know what to give you
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[18:10] mAritz: 
ACTION is sad

[18:10] mAritz: but i could just fix that in the package.json, right? (had to fix that anyways because it's not valid json in the tarball -.- )
[18:11] isaacs: mAritz: send em a pull req
[18:11] isaacs: yikes.  yeah
[18:11] isaacs: add "main" : "lib/markdown.js"
[18:12] mAritz: isaacs: thanks a lot :)
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[18:12] _announcer: Twitter: "Dynamically creating and joining DHT nodes in the #nodejs repl. Fun! Now to build something useful..." -- Bill Casarin. http://twitter.com/jb55/status/20995247753
[18:12] mAritz: i always get "EISDIR" errors btw. i just ignore them, but is that a known problem?
[18:12] bradleymeck: but yea creationix, i tend to add the es-discuss things to overload, they ignore that except mark. they seem to be trying to limit things greatly
[18:12] mAritz: (they occur in tmp cleanup)
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[18:13] _announcer: Twitter: "Growing ever more fond of prototyping real-time web stuff with node.js. http://screencast.com/t/YWI2ZWYwZWUt" -- Einar Otto Stangvik. http://twitter.com/einaros/status/20995279847
[18:13] isaacs: mAritz: that's odd.  maybe you can remove the offending dir by hand?
[18:13] mAritz: did that a few times, got annoying and so i just ignore it now :P
[18:13] creationix: bradleymeck: I just subscribed yesterday, so I'm not sure how the list goes
[18:14] technoweenie: damnit i keep missing jed
[18:17] _announcer: Twitter: "I'm happy to see that my work on a node.js memcached client is being adopted by the community. 3 Forks & 10 watchers http://is.gd/e6zaU \o/" -- Arnout Kazemier. http://twitter.com/3rdEden/status/20995540792
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[18:20] bradleymeck: creationix you looked as es harmony?
[18:20] bradleymeck: s/as/at
[18:20] creationix: it's just a random collection of new features right?
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[18:23] bradleymeck: yea, but they are done by big ppl in the ecmascript spec world
[18:23] sh1mmer: technoweenie: btw. I got riak-js working. The API is now different form the docs.
[18:23] deepthawtz has joined the channel
[18:23] technoweenie: whatd you change?
[18:24] sh1mmer: var Riak = require('riak-node');
[18:24] sh1mmer: db = new Riak();
[18:24] sh1mmer: the rest is the same
[18:24] technoweenie: whaaat thats lame
[18:24] sh1mmer: you can use getClient but it doesn't use Riak defaults
[18:24] sh1mmer: you have to create a new object to instantiate the defaults
[18:25] voodootikigod: sh1mmer: when did you start using riak
[18:25] voodootikigod: ?
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[18:25] sh1mmer: voodootikigod: playing with it for the DNS server
[18:25] voodootikigod: nice
[18:25] sh1mmer: I think leroux got me interested when we went out drinking with them at OSCON
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[18:25] sh1mmer: :D
[18:25] technoweenie: sh1mmer: ok well i want to get that shit cleaned up
[18:26] technoweenie: requiring riak-node makes no sense
[18:26] technoweenie: jquery cant use commonjs modules anyway
[18:26] sh1mmer: he's killing jquery support
[18:26] technoweenie: yea we talked about it.  it's a "nice to have" feature
[18:27] sh1mmer: since basho have a client it seems redundant
[18:27] technoweenie: basically its going to be more like nori, with the same boring name :/
[18:27] sh1mmer: heh
[18:27] sh1mmer: nom, sushi :)
[18:27] technoweenie: its such a perfect name
[18:27] technoweenie: i may have to turn nori into a riak-js wrapper that adds more orm features
[18:27] technoweenie: anyways
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[18:29] ryah: pgriess: ping
[18:29] pgriess: ryah: pong
[18:29] creationix: wow, low latency ;)
[18:29] ryah: pgriess: when you said google paper on ssl- you meant http://www.imperialviolet.org/2010/06/25/overclocking-ssl.html
[18:30] ryah: or is there something else?
[18:30] pgriess: hm, this doesn't look quite the same
[18:30] pgriess: let me dig a bit
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[18:31] pgriess: ryah: just kidding. that was it ;)
[18:31] _announcer: Twitter: ""multithreaded-rails-is-generally-better" 90% plugging his own framework 10% node.js bashing. http://is.gd/eeON1 Seems like someone hates js" -- Arnout Kazemier. http://twitter.com/3rdEden/status/20996417464
[18:32] sh1mmer: that talk at velocity was excellent
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[18:33] pgriess: ryah: i withdraw my statement yesterday that most of that paper was about cert management
[18:33] pgriess: ryah: though there are several major issues identified that are just that. seems like more fixes can be done unlaterally on the server than i had initially thought
[18:33] pgriess: (oscp stapling, false start, etc)
[18:34] _announcer: Twitter: "I'm not saying node.js is all rainbows and unicorn poop, but that expected when you play with bleeding edge software. Keeps it challenging" -- Arnout Kazemier. http://twitter.com/3rdEden/status/20996560274
[18:36] tjholowaychuk: node is not unicorn poop? news to me
[18:36] JimBastard: tjholowaychuk: have you tried using node yet?
[18:36] JimBastard: its pretty cool
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[18:36] FransWillem: w00t! my javascript-haskell-mashup can calculate 100 prime numbers :p
[18:37] JimBastard: i can calculate prime numbers
[18:37] JimBastard: 7
[18:37] JimBastard: 11
[18:37] tjholowaychuk: JimBastard: but its not unicorn poop! I cant use it anymore
[18:37] JimBastard: 13
[18:37] JimBastard: 17
[18:37] JimBastard: mad easy
[18:37] wink_: keep going, you're seeding my RNG
[18:37] JimBastard: thats what she said
[18:37] wink_: heyo!
[18:37] JimBastard: 19
[18:37] JimBastard: 23
[18:37] JimBastard: 31
[18:37] JimBastard: 37
[18:37] JimBastard: 41 ?
[18:38] JimBastard: im just guessing
[18:38] wink_: ya
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[18:41] creationix: tjholowaychuk: I'm thinking of using expresso
[18:41] tjholowaychuk: creationix: aight
[18:41] creationix: i can haz coverage?
[18:41] tjholowaychuk: creationix: yup :D --serial mode needs some loven
[18:41] tjholowaychuk: but depending on what you are doing you might not need it
[18:41] creationix: tjholowaychuk: we'll see if it works with my ivy env
[18:42] tjholowaychuk: it compiles node-jscoverage(1) for you so you will need that
[18:42] tjholowaychuk: in there
[18:42] creationix: hmm, what's that
[18:43] tjholowaychuk: its a c tool that instruments the js with statement based coverage. basically ends up just looking like this in your file __$jscoverge['file'][4]++
[18:43] tjholowaychuk: something like that
[18:44] tjholowaychuk: then i use that to output the results in the fancy table n LOC/SLOC
[18:44] creationix: I see, compiling now...
[18:44] tjholowaychuk: ideally it would be 100% js but my json ast library is kinda slow
[18:45] mikeal: creationix, mjr_, isaacs: I have a few ideas to bounce off ya
[18:45] isaacs: k
[18:45] isaacs: 
ACTION feeling bouncy

[18:45] mikeal: i'm thinking about this http server thing
[18:45] mikeal: a replacement for nginx basically
[18:45] mikeal: first off
[18:46] mikeal: I don't think it's a good idea to have the configuration be dynamic javascript
[18:46] bradleymeck: wonder if we could get the v8 debugger api to have js land setup
[18:46] mikeal: it's too likely to crash at weird times
[18:46] mikeal: and it's too hard to reset the configuration without a reboot
[18:46] mikeal: so i'm thinking declarative configuration using JSON
[18:47] creationix: mikeal: won't the crash be a right away thing
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[18:47] mikeal: but, allow a configuration where we pass of the request event to a request listener in another module
[18:47] creationix: like syntax errors
[18:48] creationix: hmm
[18:48] mikeal: creationix:  no, you could just fuck something up
[18:48] mikeal: lik try to use a callback inside a request event handler
[18:48] FransWillem: mikeal: Why not try to parse a valid nginx configuration file?
[18:48] mikeal: because config files are gross
[18:48] mikeal: and nginx config files are impossible to understand
[18:48] mikeal: only rivaled by apache config files
[18:48] atmos: nginx is WAY simpler than apache :)
[18:49] wink_: 
ACTION places sendmail on the table

[18:49] tjholowaychuk: agreed
[18:49] wink_: your move.
[18:49] atmos: i think i'm biased cause i've been using it for a while now though
[18:49] mikeal: i'm not concerned with compatibility except for stuff like .htaccess
[18:49] creationix: mikeal: ok, continue please
[18:49] atmos: wink_: m4 is exempt from this discussion
[18:49] isaacs: mikeal: wait, why not not use js as your config language?
[18:49] wink_: :p
[18:49] isaacs: 
ACTION doesn't get why json is nec better

[18:49] mikeal: isaacs: two reasons 1) it could lead to user errors at bad times 2) it's hard to reset the running configuration without restarted the process
[18:50] isaacs: mikeal: ok... but restarting the process should be easy anyway, right?
[18:50] mikeal: you could easily write an API that generated a JSON object for the cnfig
[18:50] creationix: mikeal: you can eval js just as easy as you can parse json
[18:50] tjholowaychuk: js would be cool, you could iterate things when needed etc, and not have to write the damn quotes all the time
[18:50] atmos: mikeal: nginx handles it by not restarting unless the new config is valid :P
[18:50] isaacs: creationix: ew, no
[18:50] creationix: just saying, require isn't the only way to consume js
[18:50] mikeal: creationix: but if that eval has a setTimeout or setInterval in it you won't clear it
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[18:51] mikeal: trust me, i wanted the config to just be code and then I realized all the problems with it
[18:51] mikeal: the config needs to be declarative
[18:51] isaacs: mikeal: so, you have a "please restart yourself" option, and that starts up a new proc with the new config, and if that fails, it doesn't bring the others down
[18:51] ryan_gahl: node.js is overhyped
[18:51] mikeal: atmos: right, that works because the config isn't code
[18:51] mikeal: it's easy to have valid code that has bugs in it :)
[18:51] atmos: mikeal: see isaacs ^
[18:51] mikeal: that's why the declarative config is important
[18:51] atmos: mikeal: you can't save users from doing bad things
[18:51] isaacs: mikeal: ok, i see.
[18:51] atmos: you can save them from trying ot restart something with invalid code though
[18:51] isaacs: mikeal: it is very hard to have json with bugs.
[18:52] isaacs: json might, however, lie to you
[18:52] atmos: i might be misunderstanding how you're thinking of replacing a running config
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[18:52] mikeal: isaacs: how is that going to work when I have an in-process request handler, i'm on port 80, and i have long running connecitons?
[18:52] mikeal: i'm gonna have to kill all the connections
[18:52] isaacs: mikeal: cut up this problem.
[18:52] atmos: mikeal: you seen unicorn ?
[18:53] atmos: i know you ahte ruby but it solves that problem 
[18:53] mikeal: yeah
[18:53] atmos: well, dunno if you hate it but i thought you had a python background :)
[18:53] mikeal: so, if you want dynamic handlers
[18:53] isaacs: mikeal: so, you have 3 things that need to happen.  1) bring up a new child 2) tell those children to close up shop 3) wait for them to be closed.
[18:53] mikeal: you can just handle the request
[18:53] mikeal: that's a config option
[18:53] mikeal: we just pass the request event off to your code
[18:53] isaacs: mikeal: and, in fact, for 2 and 3, you could just tell their servers to stop listening, and then the connections will die off.
[18:54] isaacs: mikeal: but having a few children running connections with outdated code is not so bad.  it's erlangy!
[18:54] mikeal: isaacs: that doesn't work when you've got comet connections trying to stay alive for 20 minutes
[18:54] isaacs: mikeal: no, actually, i'd say it DOES work when you've got 20 minute connections.
[18:54] isaacs: mikeal: and that killing that connection is an example of "not working"
[18:54] mikeal: oh i see what you're saying
[18:54] atmos: lol, 20 minute connections
[18:54] mikeal: you stop listening
[18:54] isaacs: mikeal: but you could have a config option that says "when i say restart, you better fucking restart"
[18:55] isaacs: mikeal: like a timeout after which it starts killing off cnxnx
[18:55] mikeal: config change isn't a "restart"
[18:55] isaacs: mikeal: s/restart/new configed code starts listening, old code stops listening/
[18:56] isaacs: mikeal: so you have a supervisor process that can spin up new children, keep track of their pids, and send signals that tell them what to do.
[18:56] bradleymeck: ryah_gahl, it is certainly being attempted to fill roles it is not meant to :/
[18:57] creationix: will http.Server exit the event loop automatically after close and all requests have finished?
[18:57] ryan_gahl: whoa... talk about a mashup
[18:57] ryan_gahl: ryah_gahl? lol
[18:57] isaacs: creationix: yes (unless there's a bug)
[18:57] x_or: JimBastard.  So you confirmed the code I was using was not problematic, looks like something inside of connect?  Just read your comments, looks like http-proxy module does not work for posts foryou either.
[18:57] Viriix: ok, so let me see if i finally got my head around this. A simple way to describe lexical scope, is a hierarchal scope chain that rolls down the backtrace
[18:57] creationix: it would be really neat if we had scoped event loops
[18:58] creationix: so you could detect that there are no outstanding events or listeners for a particular request
[18:58] ryan_gahl: bradleymeck: what roles do mean, curiously? IMHO it may be more that it's being used for roles it's just not quite ready for yet
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[18:58] ryan_gahl: you*
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[18:59] Viriix: creationix, you can always hack something up like an event counter or something
[18:59] bradleymeck: creationix, you can do that with gc Collectors or Weakmap/Ephemeron tables. alas those arent built into node native
[18:59] Viriix: then emit when it hits zero
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[18:59] creationix: Viriix: well, I need something native and built-in
[18:59] x_or: creationix:  I was troubleshooting an issue with using connect and a proxy for POST requests.  For example, if you are proxying to a rails app in the background.  JimBastard was helping me.  Can you tell me if anything looks weird with these gists?  http://gist.github.com/521254, http://gist.github.com/521257, http://gist.github.com/521259.  Pretty simple code, but my POST requests hang.
[18:59] creationix: the goal is to catch errors
[19:00] Viriix: did i get that right though, a simple way to describe lexical scope, is a hierarchy of scopes that role down the backtrace?
[19:00] x_or: creationix:  Or, is there a mailing list where I can address this kind of thing?  Not sure if I missed that but did not see it in the new docs.
[19:00] tjholowaychuk: x_or: we dont have a mailing list right now
[19:01] x_or: Ok.
[19:01] tjholowaychuk: well specific to connect
[19:01] tjholowaychuk: AFAIK
[19:01] creationix: tjholowaychuk: if there was one you surely would know ;)
[19:01] isaacs: mikeal: actually, the supervisor bit is not terribly hard.
[19:01] bradleymeck: creationix, let me write you up something, its rather nasty but it can be done in raw js albeit a bit... clunky
[19:02] FransWillem: creationix: Did you get a chance to the e-mail I sent you about WebSocket support in connect ?
[19:02] isaacs: mikeal: just have the server open stdin and stop accepting new requests when it gets the stop signal.
[19:02] creationix: bradleymeck: I think we need the eventSource hooks ryah is adding to node
[19:02] bradleymeck: nope, but the other way is gross
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[19:02] x_or: tjholowaychuk:  If you take a look at those three gists you'll see the issue.  They are very few lines of code but POST requests never get through to my rails app.
[19:02] bradleymeck: you have to override the EventEmitter.prototype stuff T_T
[19:03] bradleymeck: ryan_gahl: people trying to use it to buffer things rather than dealing w/ streams, node is terribad at buffered input compared to streams
[19:03] creationix: FransWillem:  no, I think it got lost
[19:03] ryan_gahl: bradleymeck: ah like the dude trying to re-create nginx in the mailing list
[19:03] ryan_gahl: agreed
[19:03] bradleymeck: yea...
[19:04] bradleymeck: there are very few situations you should actually need to buffer in reality
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[19:07] x_or: tjholowaychuk:  Not sure if you got my message above, if this is not a good time I will find an alternative path.  
[19:07] tjholowaychuk: x_or: right a
[19:07] tjholowaychuk: x_or: *right ATM i dont have time sorry man!
[19:09] x_or: tjholowaychuk:  OK, take a look at those gists when you have a chance.  They document the problem pretty concretely, and are very few lines of code.  
[19:09] x_or: Thank you.
[19:12] _announcer: Twitter: "Node.js and Cometd, new tech to keep an eyed peeled for." -- alpeb. http://twitter.com/alpeb/status/20998854737
[19:12] thehin: Where is the official instruction set on how to install node.js on Windows/Cygwin
[19:13] bradleymeck: creationix: http://gist.github.com/521518 , will map a unique id to events not yet fired at least once, dont know if thats exactly what you were looking for
[19:13] _announcer: Twitter: "#nodejs repl tab completition = ♡ & ☼" -- Felix Geisendörfer. http://twitter.com/felixge/status/20998926066
[19:14] bradleymeck: thehin, i dont think there is an Official anything on windows
[19:14] thehin: I followed this http://wiki.github.com/ry/node/building-node-on-windowscygwin
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[19:15] thehin: but i keep getting errors, specifically, task: libv8.a SConstruct -> libv8.a
[19:15] ryan_gahl: man, i just have a huge mental block as to WHY anyone wants to run node on windows
[19:15] thehin: ryan_gahl: corporate red tape
[19:15] thehin: you think i want to run cygwin
[19:15] ryan_gahl: lol, ok good :)
[19:15] mjr_: Jed's talk the other day in Palo Alto: http://vimeo.com/14093679
[19:15] thehin: i rather drink poison
[19:16] ryan_gahl: not a bad alternative
[19:16] thehin: but i just want to get this running, prototype a long poll with some static file sharing (paperboy)
[19:16] thehin: then make a ploy to get me a dual core xeon machine so i can run vmware lol
[19:16] ryan_gahl: there ya go
[19:17] ryan_gahl: go for quad though
[19:17] thehin: yeah
[19:17] ryan_gahl: (and sorry for not being helpful, I know nothing about running node on windows)
[19:17] thehin: dual quad xeon
[19:18] thehin: or who knows maybe ill have them spring for the x5680's :-)
[19:18] wink_: ThePub: if it's just for prototyping, you could always get virtualbox and just boot a linux vm
[19:18] wink_: er thehin
[19:18] thehin: wink_: im using a POS dual socket P4 machine right now
[19:18] thehin: running any sort of virtualization on my dev machine would completely turn it to shit
[19:18] ryan_gahl: wink_: appears issue is lack of power for VMs
[19:18] wink_: yeah that sounds painful
[19:19] thehin: i have my own personal mac book next to my main machine
[19:19] thehin: but i would like to do it in windows just in case to see if it even works
[19:19] creationix: bradleymeck: no, but that's neat too
[19:20] bradleymeck: what exactly did you want then?
[19:21] _announcer: Twitter: "nodejs meetup:The first video of Ryan's talk: http://vimeo.com/14071325" -- Cagdas Tulek. http://twitter.com/ctulek/status/20999382543
[19:21] creationix: time for lunch, but basically what node does to know when to exit automatically
[19:21] thehin: anyway, so can you install node via package managers on ubuntu now?
[19:21] _announcer: Twitter: "Pretty #HTML5 Pong http://jeko.free.fr/megapong i wonder if it can be made to work with #nodejs http://ur1.ca/13n3j" -- Popa Adrian Marius. http://twitter.com/mapopa/status/20999411421
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[19:23] _announcer: Twitter: "Game of the evening create a &quot;diffuser slides,&quot; it is I who controls the frequency of travel of the slides. Mouhahaha: D # nodejs" [fr] -- Julien Dubois. http://twitter.com/Artusamak/status/20999516941
[19:23] EyePulp: any tutorials or good examples of creating middleware in node?
[19:23] bradleymeck: eyepulp using connect?
[19:24] EyePulp: bradleymeck: I don't know what connect is... =)
[19:24] EyePulp: so... maybe?
[19:24] bradleymeck: http://github.com/senchalabs/connect
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[19:25] isaacs: thehin: not in a way that actually works
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[19:26] EyePulp: bradleymeck: ah - cool
[19:26] EyePulp: thanks
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[19:35] mscdex: thehin: i think someone may have had a ppa, i don't remember who though. i automatically build the latest stable and unstable releases here: http://mscdex.net/node
[19:35] digitalspaghetti: using express, does anyone know how i can seperate apps out (i.e. a file for each url route)?
[19:35] tjholowaychuk: digitalspaghetti: check out the blog example. ./examples/blog
[19:35] isaacs: ryah: you should make your slides white-on-black so they look better on video.
[19:36] digitalspaghetti: tjholowaychuk: cool :)  btw I'm building a ExtJS-based app on top of Node + couchdb :D
[19:36] digitalspaghetti: (well hopfully)
[19:36] tjholowaychuk: digitalspaghetti: alternatively you could have a module that exports a function. module.exports = function(app){ app.get(...) }; and in your main file do require('./somefile')(app)
[19:36] tjholowaychuk: either way it is somewhat non ideal but that is the nature of the module system
[19:37] tjholowaychuk: or you could iterate some files using readdir and load them in programmatically 
[19:37] digitalspaghetti: i want to seperate everything out as much as possible, almost django-app style
[19:37] digitalspaghetti: it's quite a big app
[19:39] digitalspaghetti: basically i'm looking at writing most of the logic in ExtJS (grids with REST and a lot data views), use COuchDB backend and really only use NodeJS as a middleware to handle routes and database calls
[19:39] EyePulp: are methods like response.simpleJSON currently documented at nodejs.org/api.html ?  i can't find that one in particular but didn't know if the docs were simply behind the code.
[19:40] EyePulp: s/behind/older than
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[19:44] JRCARR2: oh man... oh man... I need to escape the mental asylum that is called "A Fortune 500 company"
[19:44] EyePulp: forget that question - I see simpleJSON was added as part of this code I'm hacking.
[19:44] EyePulp: ignore me
[19:44] JRCARR2: I wish I could get by one hour without seeing a WTF :)
[19:45] bradleymeck: EyePulp, dont forget JSON.stringify/parse are built in as well
[19:45] isaacs: EyePulp: the docs are pretty up to date, usually.  not to say they don't ever have bugs, but usually when a feature is "sanctioned", it shows up in the docs.
[19:46] EyePulp: heh - yea, I just needed to search a bit more in the codebase.  so much to learn
[19:46] tjholowaychuk: fuck colloquy's damn swatting sound
[19:47] tjholowaychuk: there we go
[19:47] bradleymeck: swat swat 
[19:48] ryan_gahl: JRCARR2: WTF (not even 5 minutes, sry mane)
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[19:58] mjr_: mikeal: I lost your comment in the scrollback, sorry.
[19:58] mikeal: that's alright
[19:59] digitalspaghetti: 
ACTION pokes daleharvey in the eye

[19:59] daleharvey: err, hello?
[19:59] digitalspaghetti: (it's Tane)
[20:00] daleharvey: ah cool, sorry about that, get my nicks confused, hows it going, you enjoying node.js too?
[20:02] rauchg_ has joined the channel
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[20:03] bradleymeck: is there an event for when node goes into idle mode?
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[20:04] mscdex: bradleymeck: what do you mean by idle?
[20:06] mAritz: hm... i have a weird problem: the callback of a child_process.exec doesn't get called until i manually kill the executed process
[20:06] digitalspaghetti: daleharvey: yea, just starting with Express
[20:07] digitalspaghetti: DJango has been pissing me off writing my app, so I'm looking at node + couchdb instead
[20:07] mscdex: mAritz: that's how it's supposed to work
[20:07] mscdex: mAritz: the callback is executed when the child process ends
[20:07] jimmybaker_ has joined the channel
[20:08] mAritz: oh, ok. was that changed recently? 
[20:08] mAritz: do i need to spawn and listen now?
[20:08] mscdex: mAritz: no, .spawn has always been the one that allows you to attach handlers to stdout, stderr, and exit
[20:09] mscdex: .exec is just a wrapper around .spawn that basically does all the adding of listeners and all that
[20:09] hellp has joined the channel
[20:09] mAritz: strange, about 2 months ago the exec way worked without the childprocess ending :/
[20:10] mscdex: you must have been daydreaming ;-)
[20:10] codemariner has joined the channel
[20:10] mscdex: that's the way it's always worked for me since i started using node
[20:11] JRCARR2: wow people ask weird questions to poke holes in trying something new
[20:11] JRCARR2: got asked "how do I required a module if I want to use an extension besides js?"
[20:13] wink_: heh
[20:13] devinus: JRCARR2: that's retarded
[20:13] ceej: works like a charm http://nodechat.heroku.com
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[20:17] bradleymeck: mscdex, when its about to swap event loop iterations
[20:17] mscdex: huh? :S
[20:19] bradleymeck: when the functions in a synchronous execution finish, it grabs a new event, after the finish, before the new event
[20:19] _announcer: Twitter: "revised my node.js-Prese order not on the Barcamp tomorrow to stand with empty hands. SlideShare karaoke is also an option. # Bcki" [de] -- eibaan. http://twitter.com/eibaan/status/21002917052
[20:20] bradleymeck: ie: right before the event loop controller starts up again
[20:21] mscdex: oh, i dunno
[20:21] mscdex: i think it's been asked before though, either here or on the ML
[20:22] ceej: back to work :)
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[20:33] digitalspaghetti: is there a UUID library for nodejs>?  I'm looking to create some for CounchDB
[20:33] tjholowaychuk: digitalspaghetti: i think most are just packaged within other libraries
[20:34] tjholowaychuk: digitalspaghetti: http://wiki.github.com/ry/node/modules can check there too
[20:34] tjholowaychuk: seems like there are a few
[20:34] digitalspaghetti: seems like something that should be included in node-couchdb to be honest, since it's recommended for counchdb to generate your own
[20:34] digitalspaghetti: i might bug felix, or maybe submit a patch if i get time
[20:36] softdrink has joined the channel
[20:38] onar: which is the most mature sqlite binding for node at this point?
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[20:43] nex3: Oh my god, Creationix isn't here
[20:43] nex3: How can this be?
[20:43] tjholowaychuk: lol
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[20:50] mscdex: nex3: maushu is here, he's next best
[20:51] tjholowaychuk: for what? what do you need nex3
[20:51] tjholowaychuk: connect stuff?
[20:51] tjholowaychuk: wahoo new github wikis
[20:52] mscdex: :p
[20:52] mscdex: tjholowaychuk: where?
[20:53] tjholowaychuk: i think they just released it a few minutes ago
[20:53] tjholowaychuk: you should have a notification 
[20:53] maushu: wut
[20:53] sveisvei: tjholowaychuk:  ouuu, long comming
[20:53] tjholowaychuk: finally no more textile 
[20:53] nex3: mscdex, tjholowaychuk: I had a question about nstore
[20:54] tjholowaychuk: nex3: oh :) probably cant help tons there but shoot anyways. I have only used it a few times
[20:54] saikat has joined the channel
[20:54] mscdex: tjholowaychuk: ah i see, an upgrade on their side. git-powered wiki = <3
[20:54] nex3: I was wondering if the stream has any particular ordering
[20:55] alexkwolfe: isaacs: i'm trying to launch a connect app using spark.  both are installed with npm.  the spark package neither depends on nor has a dependency on my app (obviously).  spark requires server.js which requires app.js.  I've registered app.js as main.  But when app.js is loaded my require.paths doesn't include any of the npm paths.  any ideas?
[20:55] mscdex: i guess github hasn't rolled out the new wiki system everywhere?
[20:55] tjholowaychuk: nex3: should be FIFO AFAIK. I think I was using the stream feature for "keys"
[20:55] blogometer: What is the difference between the two sqlite bindings?
[20:56] mscdex: one is lite-r? ;p
[20:56] blogometer: Which one do you prefer (if you use SQLite)?
[20:56] nex3: tjholowaychuk: Looking at the source, it seems like it's whatever order Object.keys() decides to use
[20:56] tjholowaychuk: nex3: actually nvm I dont check ordering in keys. 
[20:57] tjholowaychuk: mscdex: ya that is sweet, can actually see what people change now
[20:57] technoweenie has joined the channel
[20:57] mscdex: i thought maybe the node wiki would have had been upgraded as part of the first rollout, but no such luck :\
[20:58] mscdex: oh wait nevermind, i didn't read the whole blog post :S
[20:59] stagas: anyone got a deep copy object function?
[21:00] isaacs: alexkwolfe: spark needs to be run as a cli script, and given your app.js as an agument.
[21:00] isaacs: alexkwolfe: you should probably make your app depend on spark, though.
[21:00] isaacs: alexkwolfe: you could then do something like this in your app's package.json:  { "scripts" : {"start" : "spark app.js" }}
[21:01] alexkwolfe: ah.
[21:01] femtooo has joined the channel
[21:01] alexkwolfe: ok.  thanks.  i'll give that a go.
[21:01] isaacs: alexkwolfe: then you can do "npm start my-app" to start it up
[21:02] alexkwolfe: i tried making it a cli script as you suggest, but my package doesnt' depend on spark.  so maybe that's my issue.
[21:02] isaacs: alexkwolfe: npm start isn't completely wonderful yet.  it needs more sophistication. http://github.com/isaacs/npm/issues#issue/117
[21:03] alexkwolfe: still no dice.  i'm on npm 0.1.23.  maybe that's the issue?
[21:04] isaacs: alexkwolfe: that's very old.
[21:04] isaacs: alexkwolfe: run "make" in the code folder.
[21:04] blogometer: Any thoughts from anyone on SQLite? Which one?
[21:04] alexkwolfe: yeah. it's the latest from brew.
[21:04] isaacs: alexkwolfe: oh, yay, brew.
[21:04] alexkwolfe: =)
[21:04] isaacs: alexkwolfe: better to just get node and npm from source, imo
[21:05] alexkwolfe: yeah.  maybe i ought to do that.
[21:05] digitalspaghetti: so doesn npm do pip-style requirements files?
[21:05] mscdex: stagas: you can probably use the old (removed some time ago) process.mixin function: http://github.com/ry/node/blob/62d9852c3d6ed32825abfd79645c72a66fb00e6f/src/node.js#L109-L168
[21:05] isaacs: digitalspaghetti: no, npm does npm-style requirements files ;)
[21:05] digitalspaghetti: isaacs: :p
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[21:06] digitalspaghetti: but you know what i mean?  I can run the script through npm and it'll install all dependancies
[21:06] digitalspaghetti: ?
[21:06] mscdex: stagas: may have to set deep to true in the first part there
[21:06] isaacs: digitalspaghetti: yeah, it does that.
[21:07] isaacs: digitalspaghetti: write a package.json file, and then do "npm link" or "npm install" and it'll link or install your package and install its dependencies.
[21:07] mscdex: stagas: or use mixin(true, obj)
[21:07] mscdex: :o
[21:08] digitalspaghetti: isaacs: cool, i need to think of these things for our app :D
[21:08] isaacs: digitalspaghetti: npm help json
[21:09] digitalspaghetti: when it goes live, each client will get their own vm slice and our software installed on it with all dependancies
[21:10] isaacs: digitalspaghetti: cool
[21:10] isaacs: 
ACTION considering resurrecting sns...

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[21:11] justin_: is there a node.js package for ubuntu?
[21:11] tjholowaychuk: justin_: pre-compiled binaries?
[21:11] justin_: yeah
[21:12] tjholowaychuk: justin_: check out nDistro
[21:12] tjholowaychuk: http://github.com/visionmedia/ndistro
[21:12] tjholowaychuk: justin_: the binaries are here http://github.com/visionmedia/nodes
[21:12] indexzero: Looking to get the ip address of the client in node. I thought about just exec'ing ifconfig, any thoughts?
[21:12] stagas has joined the channel
[21:13] alexkwolfe: isaacs: hey look. once I installed the latest npm, it just worked! funny thing, that.
[21:13] alexkwolfe: isaacs: thanks for your help.
[21:13] isaacs: alexkwolfe: np
[21:13] justin_: tjholowaychuk: cool, thanks
[21:13] isaacs: alexkwolfe: i have a habit of forgetting npm's bugs once theyr'e fixed in a new version.  they move past too quick to remember.
[21:13] alexkwolfe: isaacs: =)
[21:14] alexkwolfe: isaacs: so basically the rule for getting the npm path shims is that I have to require something from "main" or execute something from "bin"?
[21:15] isaacs: alexkwolfe: yes.
[21:15] alexkwolfe: isaacs: ok. it's all becoming clear to me now. =)
[21:15] isaacs: alexkwolfe: i have an open issue to add a  "modules" hash for exporting more stuff.
[21:15] isaacs: alexkwolfe: it's not very complicated, but just involves adding a bunch of stuff.
[21:17] alexkwolfe: isaacs: gotcha. but i guess i'll get a shim if I require something out of a "directories" location as well? how's that different from "modules"?
[21:17] satori_ has joined the channel
[21:17] isaacs: alexkwolfe: no, you won't get a shim if you require out of the symbolically linked "lib" directory.
[21:17] isaacs: alexkwolfe: that's why that's going away in a future version, and it warns you every time it does that.
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[21:19] alexkwolfe: isaacs: ah ha. 
[21:19] wattz: Man, what aaaaaa day
[21:20] alexkwolfe: isaacs: so in the meantime, if I want to require something from lib, I've got to get it through the main module?
[21:20] isaacs: alexkwolfe: yeah
[21:20] isaacs: alexkwolfe: the main module has to expose that, i mean
[21:20] alexkwolfe: isaacs: yeah.  i gotcha.
[21:20] mscdex: wattz up?
[21:21] wattz: never gets old eh mscdex?
[21:21] wattz: :D
[21:21] isaacs: alexkwolfe: the feature is thoroughly specced, if you feel like contributing: http://github.com/isaacs/npm/issues#issue/144
[21:21] mscdex: nevar!
[21:21] wattz: working bob's tasks
[21:22] mscdex: the clippy implementation in node?
[21:22] wattz: lol
[21:22] alexkwolfe: isaacs: i'd love to, so long as I can get it sorted out in ma brane first. i'll have a look.
[21:22] wattz: Bob the Builder.
[21:22] mscdex: what is it again?
[21:22] wattz: V8/JS build system based of make and config
[21:22] mscdex: oh yeah
[21:22] wattz: YOU LOVE IT
[21:22] wattz: well
[21:22] mscdex: NOU
[21:22] wattz: i guess it's more like Waf and Jake mating
[21:23] mscdex: i thought waf stood for "wife acceptance factor"
[21:23] wattz: hahaha
[21:23] wattz: What assholes find?
[21:24] JimBastard has joined the channel
[21:24] JimBastard: hey party people
[21:24] wattz: JimBastard joins us... the scurge of the internet!
[21:24] isaacs: WUUUUTUP, BASTERD
[21:24] wattz: argh
[21:24] JimBastard: does anyone know a solid way to pull the current ip address of a machine that node is running on? we have an idea with sys exec + ifconfig + regex, but that makes me feel dirty, you know....down...there...
[21:25] wattz: mmmmm go on.
[21:25] mscdex: no, where?
[21:25] JimBastard: pinging a third party service isnt great either
[21:26] wattz: mscdex: his crotchtorial area
[21:26] JimBastard: surely some linus guru has an answer 
[21:26] mscdex: OH
[21:26] mscdex: I SEE
[21:26] wink_: jimt: are you wanting to avoid writing the binding yourself?
[21:26] wink_: stupid nick completion..
[21:26] JimBastard: i took care of him
[21:26] JimBastard: sup
[21:26] JRCARR2: heh
[21:26] JRCARR2: http://theoatmeal.com/comics/party_gorilla
[21:26] JimBastard: wink_: you mean write a node binding ?
[21:26] wink_: ya
[21:27] wink_: the c code to get a list of ips for the machine is pretty straightfoward
[21:27] wattz: JimBastard: make a request using Curl to Whatsmyip and then use jquery to find the element and grab the .text()
[21:27] wattz: haha
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[21:27] mscdex: JimBastard: you mean the lan ip or wan ip?
[21:28] wattz: i bet you could also just ask google somehow
[21:28] wattz: there is always a way to ask google
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[21:28] JimBastard: mscdex: so i guess the public ip, but on rackspace you can actually view the public one from ifconfig
[21:28] JimBastard: the way their nat is setup
[21:28] wattz: it's why Im now a googlic instead of a protestent
[21:28] mscdex: i see
[21:28] JimBastard: mscdex: we dont want to go outside the box if possible
[21:28] mscdex: right
[21:29] wattz: ifconfig will be your best bet
[21:29] JimBastard: wattz: ifconfg + regex? just seems wrong
[21:29] wattz: that's about it
[21:29] wattz: and if you have cloned/multiple ips you need to know what device you want
[21:29] wink_: write a binding to do it :P
[21:29] wattz: eth0, eth0:1
[21:29] JimBastard: wink_: im such a noob, could you elaborhate for me?
[21:30] wattz: JimBastard: 2 chicks at the same time
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[21:30] JimBastard: wattz: what is, what i would do if i had a million dollars?
[21:30] JimBastard: ill take the penis is mightier for $2,000
[21:31] wink_: JimBastard: sure, write a binding that creates a socket and then issues an SIOCGIFCONf ioctl on the socket
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[21:31] JimBastard: indexzero: ^^
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[21:31] wink_: it'll return you your ips, then you can pass it back into node
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[21:31] wink_: i want to get my hands dirty writing a binding, if you can wait until tomorrow, i'll write it for you
[21:31] indexzero: wink_ yes, yes I can
[21:32] JimBastard: :-)
[21:32] JimBastard: that would be awesome wink_ 
[21:32] mscdex: JimBastard: hostname -i ?
[21:32] JimBastard: -i doesnt seem to be valid on my macos
[21:32] wink_: it shouldnt take too long to do, indexzero, what timezone are you in?
[21:32] JimBastard: maybe for linux
[21:32] mscdex: 
ACTION shakes a fist at osx

[21:32] indexzero: mcdex: That works on my ubuntu box but not on my osx dev env
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[21:33] JimBastard: wink_: indexzero and i are east coast, we are the fun loving fellows behind http://github.com/nodejitsu
[21:33] JimBastard: well im fun loving, i dunno about indexzero 
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[21:33] satori_: firefox 4 multitouch looks interesting.
[21:33] indexzero: 
ACTION loves fun, I'm having lots of it in Toronto right now

[21:33] indexzero: which reminds, me, WATTUP CANADA?!
[21:33] wink_: ah cool, well im almost out for the day, but i'll do it tomorrow am if you guys are around
[21:33] JimBastard: its an international javascript party
[21:33] ashleydev__ has joined the channel
[21:33] JimBastard: for sure, im here everyday
[21:33] tjholowaychuk: go canada go
[21:33] tav_ has joined the channel
[21:34] JimBastard: http://stats.nodejs.se/
[21:34] indexzero: it's always an international javascript party with tjholowaychuk
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[21:34] tjholowaychuk: eyyyy :D
[21:34] indexzero: 
ACTION loves VanCity

[21:34] tjholowaychuk: victoria > van
[21:34] wink_: i need to get my hands dirty anyhow, i'd like to write a zeromq binding <3
[21:34] indexzero: of you're in vic?
[21:34] indexzero: I thought you were in van
[21:34] indexzero: ironically, I've been to every other major city but Tdot until now
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[21:34] indexzero: lived in Montreal for about 5 years
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[21:36] tjholowaychuk: nice. i haven't been around much in canada other than edmonton, van and vic
[21:36] tjholowaychuk: but vic is less trashy than those
[21:37] wink_: :|
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[21:37] tjholowaychuk: woah
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[21:40] bradleymeck: oh god i survived the split